Pre-Vatican 2 teaching on “outside the Church there is no salvation”

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Pre-Vatican 2 teaching on “outside the Church there is no salvation”

12wonderY
Mar 22, 2022, 5:52 pm

My Episcopal professor says the Roman Catholic Church taught an exclusionary admission to salvation. Was the catechism so much different before Vatican 2 compared to today's teaching in 830 - 848, The Church is Catholic?

22wonderY
Mar 23, 2022, 10:23 am

A friend pointed me to this page, which I found very helpful:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extra_Ecclesiam_nulla_salus

3John5918
Modifié : Mar 23, 2022, 11:03 am

It's also worth looking at some of the Vatican II teachings, particularly , Nostra aetate: ON THE RELATION OF THE CHURCH TO NON-CHRISTIAN RELIGIONS, Unitatis redintegratio: ON ECUMENISM, Dignitatis humanae: ON RELIGIOUS LIBERTY and Ad gentes divinitus: ON THE CHURCH's MISSIONARY ACTIVITY.

The Church has definitely softened its language towards a less exclusive notion of salvation and, as the Wikipedia article points out, there are different interpretations of the concept and whether it is limited only to visible members of the institutional Church. The Catechism, in the paragraphs you reference, explores the question of salvation which clearly comes from the Church but may be rather more inclusive than previously taught.

42wonderY
Mar 23, 2022, 11:22 am

I love the way the current Catechism describes the umbrella of coverage that the Church represents.

5John5918
Mar 23, 2022, 12:23 pm

>4 2wonderY:

Yes, universal and inclusive. That's one of the themes in a lot of the writings of Franciscan Fr Richard Rohr.

6brone
Mar 23, 2022, 8:35 pm

The truth is, all salvation comes though Jesus Christ and His Church, Council after council up to and including Vat ll and the CCC has taught this simple truth.. The question today with evolving doctrines of progressive theologians should be asking is not so much will they be saved if we fail to proclaim the Gospel. Paul said, to a young priest he had ordained, "Timothy stand fast in the doctrine, in the teachings which you have received, because in so doing you will both save your self and them that hear thee"....JMJ....

7John5918
Mar 23, 2022, 11:46 pm

>6 brone: The truth is, all salvation comes though Jesus Christ and His Church, Council after council up to and including Vat ll and the CCC has taught this simple truth...

Yes, but the key word there is "through", and that's where different interpretations come in. Does "through" mean only if one is a visible member of the institutional Catholic Church, or does it rather mean "because of", ie it is through/because of Christ that salvation becomes available to all?

Few real truths are simple!

8brone
Mar 24, 2022, 8:59 pm

There is only One Truth....AMDG....

9MarthaJeanne
Mar 24, 2022, 9:35 pm

"all salvation comes though Jesus Christ and His Church". The problem comes when people think they can define His Church as some human institution.

10brone
Mar 26, 2022, 9:24 am

I agree through Christ, but through his Church by some mysterious mystery as JPll once said....JMJ....

112wonderY
Mar 30, 2022, 10:53 pm

I found a partial answer to my question lying open on the floor in my former bedroom. I’m still clearing stuff out of the old house, and a good part of the mess is books.
This book is almost frozen open to the page that answers my question. So, apparently, I had been interested in it previously.
Karl Adam got himself into some twisty and bad positions on certain topics, particularly his support of Nazi anti-Jewish legislation. This book, The Spirit of Catholicism, was threatened with placement on the Index Librorum Prohibitorum in 1932; but he revised the text enough to receive Imprimatur and Nihil Obstat.
On separated Christian churches:
“In so far as they are un-Catholic and anti-Catholic… they are not able to claim the honorable title of a “mother” church.

When they set themselves up against the original Church of Christ, they took over and maintained a considerable amount of the Catholic inheritance, and also certain Catholic means of grace, in particular the sacrament of Baptism. They are therefore, if we regard them as a whole, not mere antithesis and negation, but also to a large extent thesis and affirmation of the ancient treasure of truth and grace that has come down to us from Christ and the apostles.”

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