Über-Cynic: “Cyberpunk is like heavy metal - within 5yrs the genre had defined itself and expressed all the creativity it could and then........slow steady stagnation for decades. Crusty old fans propping it up long term with enough new blood coming in (and often getting out a few years later) to give at least a sheen of relevance to the contemporary. But ultimately it's a graveyard of old ideas and concepts. Neon nostalgia.”

Me: “So it's a reflection of our times then? All the bullshit reinvention of the same tired old ideas, the sham tech 'revolutions', the get-rich-quick scams like cryptos. The endless and enduring pessimism of the 360 degree, 24/7 net, with it's small gods and rattle -shakers…“You make me want to desecrate a church or something. And ... what if we had three kick drum pedals!? What then!? A new level of metal would be born.”

Über-Cynic: “Actually a lot of modern science fiction is like Heavy Metal, or Metal Hurlant, the French comic. The cyborg eye/lens implant is very Moebius.

Me: “Actually a lot of the tropes discussed her owe far more to comics such as HM and 2000AD than cyberpunk. Megacity One was established as a high-rise, neon-flooded, filthy street dystopia in 1977. And Bladerunner was released before Gibson had even finished Neuromancer.”

Über-Cynic: “It's having a fucking long snooze then. There hasn't been a single musical innovation of any significance for what, 30yrs?”

Me: “It's the same with most new creative fields, huge innovation and dynamism for the first 5-10yrs then a long extended period of calcification and meandering in countless sub genres, interrupted by occasional bursts of the new.”

Über-Cynic: “It's already happening with electriconica and dance music. Nothing new since drum and bass really and that's nigh on 20yrs ago. But where are the flying cars? Where are the robots and cyborgs? Where are the ultra-modern homes? Where are we on transports? Are we travelling quicker today? Where are we on space colonization? Where are we on life extending/enhancing? Somebody coming here from 40 years wouldn’t be disorientated. Leave him one week with a computer, a smartphone and an internet connection and he will be just as good as us. That’s not exactly what the 21st century was supposed to be when imagined 50 years ago. We moved more slowly than expected.”

Me: “I think Shirley’s “Stormland” sort of exemplifies why the sub-genre actually doesn't really need to evolve. Instead of being about our possible future, it's much more about our present with a retro-futuristic vibe. Many of the subjects it addresses - like cybernetic body part replacement, AI ethics, Climate Change (very prominent in this novel), etc. - are now closer to reality than ever before, and therefore need to be discussed. When the first humans start cutting off healthy limbs to replace them with superior electronic ones, Cyberpunk will be more relevant than ever.

Über-Cynic: “It doesn't need to evolve, but maybe there is now room for a new genre; post-Cyberpunk. What comes next? In the 80s we seem to have sort of predicted the 2020s. What will the 2060s bring? I’m from a decade (1980s) where modernity was everywhere. Almost everything (homes, urban space, transports) was a colossal improvement from even 20 years ago. We slowed down dramatically since. Blade Runner is as much science-fiction now as it was in 1982. Maybe that’s why Cyberpunk writers are turning to more contemporary concerns like Climate Change.”

Me: “I don’t care about the supposedly predictive power of Cyberpunk. It's more about the Aesthetic. Ditto for Synthwave. Read ‘Stormland’ if you want to understand what I mean. ” ( )