Advice for a New Collector?

As the subject says, I'm a complete beginner to the world of fine/small press book collecting. I've been an avid reader and hoarder of books for a long time, and have delved into the world of 1st edition books, but never fine press books specifically, and certainly not newly published fine press books. I started digging around a few weeks back after looking for a nice edition of The Haunting of Hill House and realizing I missed out on the versions offered by Centipede and Suntup, as well as missing out on the Suntup edition of The Lottery. Recently reading The Dumas Club, and rewatching The Ninth Gate, has probably fueled the collecting itch, too.

For now, I'm signing up for all the mailing lists I can to ensure that I don't miss out on upcoming books, and I'm going to start looking into buying older fine press copies of my favorite books. After doing some quick back of a napkin math, I think I can swing 4-5 new, numbered or lettered editions a year, dependent on price and if I actually want or can get the books. It seems that a lot of fine presses deal in rights, which is an entirely new experience for me. I can't imagine being fully ready to dish out $500-2500 for a new edition of a book you love, and then that book being totally sold out in a private presale. That would be crushing.

I'm currently looking at the following presses: Suntup, Centipede, Foolscap, Charnel House, LEC, Yolla Bolly, Heavenly Monkey, Cemetery Dance, and Subterranean. Can anyone else suggest other presses I should look out for, or is there any reason to not buy books from the presses I've listed?

Any other advice, information, or general words of warning for a neophyte would be greatly appreciated.

Too much to type right now, but there is a magazine you should subscribe to: Fine Books and Collections.

It seems like you’re in to horror, so I’d also recommend Ash-Tree press. Their books aren’t nearly as exciting as Centipede or Suntup- little to no artwork, not printed letterpress- but they are nicely bound and in editions often limited to (I think) 500 copies. They’re no longer active, but they did a fantastic job bringing long forgotten authors back in to print.

I think the best advice I can really give you is to know what you want. When I started getting back in to collecting Centipede Press titles after a long hiatus I went a bit crazy buying up every decently priced, out-of-print title I would come across. It’s a great way to spend a lot of money on books you might not be terribly interested in, only to have to scramble for funds when you find the ones you really do want. For me, unless a book/author is already one of my favorites, or one I’ve been interested in reading for some time, I usually end up passing.

Set up alerts on eBay and AbeBooks for publishers/ titles you’re interested in, and familiarize yourself with booksellers that specialize in fine books (other members here can provide you a list- I can only think of Bromer Booksellers and James & Mary Laurie booksellers right now). Get involved in other groups, too. There’s a small press book group on Facebook with a lot of buying and selling, as well as groups on The Dark Tower and Cemetery Dance.

>1 HiroProtagonist9:

1. Other private presses to follow and/or receive e-mails from (if currently active): Barbarian Press, Salvage Press, Whittington Press, Nomad Press, Golden Cockerel Press, Arion Press, Shakespeare Head Press, Allen Press, Folio Society.

Suggestions:

1. Make a Wants List of books and works of literature you wish to obtain in a fine press or private press edition. Ask this forum for suggestions once you have decided upon a specific work of literature and determine how much you wish to budget for it.

2. Learn how to do effective book searches on abebooks.com and vialibri.net to get a feel for the range of prices a specific book you are looking for is currently selling at.

3. With rare exceptions, always pay up (within reason) to obtain your desired book in the finest condition available. Do not buy junk or books in badly compromised condition because they are "bargains". They are not, and these will become purchases you soon regret.

4. You do not have to purchase "new" editions unless it is a book you specifically want. Many literature classics are available from multiple private presses that have been published over the past 120 years.

5. Familiarize yourself with Chris Adamson's currently dormant Books and Vines website (booksandvines.com). Over an eight year period, Chris carefully reviewed and photographed hundreds of private press books and this remains an essential source of information for private press book collectors, both new and experienced. You will obtain many wonderful book collecting ideas from the B&V website.

This looks great. I've got the website up now to read some articles, and I'll likely go ahead and subscribe. Thanks for the recommendation!

I'll check out Ash-Tree to see if they have editions of the books I like.

That's all really good advice. I felt like limiting myself to 4-5 new fine press books a year would be a good way to ensure that I only get the books I really like, instead just buying because a fear of missing out, which seems fairly pervasive around these fine press publications. I've been reading a lot of threads from old releases of Suntup and Centipede books and it seems like a lot of people are on the fence, where they don't really love the book but also don't want to miss out. Suntups numbered edition rights seem to really bring that out, considering people want to own the complete set of whichever number they have.

In addition to horror, I collect a lot of "lost world" subgenre books and original serial magazine publications, as well as older travelogues. Foolscap's edition of The Travels of Sir John Mandeville is really calling to me.

I'll 100% set up alerts for titles I want and I'm already on CD, but I'll get on TDT too.

1. I've made a list. I'm currently researching fine press editions of all the titles on my list. One of the main reasons I signed up to this forum is to solicit advice on the best editions of the books I want.

2. I've mostly used those sites to focus on 1st edition pricing, just by researching the year of original publication/publisher, and then narrowing down the search results to get a ballpark idea of the current price for a book I'm looking at. Do you have any other tips on using those sites?

3. I 100% agree with this. The only items I buy in questionable condition are original serial magazine publications, since they're so few and far between, and the material used to publish them doesn't lend itself to conservation.

4. Yeah, I really only got the 4-5 new editions a year number from looking at recent publications from fine presses. There's only 4-5 books in that time period from all those presses that I would absolutely want. Most of my purchases will likely be older editions.

5. I had never heard of this website, and it looks wonderful. I think I'm going to spend a lot of time going through their index of book reviews.

I'll check out those other presses today. Thanks for all the advice!

>7 HiroProtagonist9:

Collecting 1st edition books vs. collecting fine & private press books are entirely separate animals with VERY different pricing structures. Be certain you make the differentiation and decide which you wish to collect.

Meanwhile, to help get you started.........

List the 2 or 3 works of literature that are most important for you to collect in a fine or private press edition. Suggestions can then be made for you to research in this regard.

>1 HiroProtagonist9:

One final and very important suggestion. Read the link below carefully so that you know and understand what a "bookjacker" is. Avoid listing on abebooks.com and vialibri.net that have vague, generic boilerplate descriptions such as:

1. "May have underlining", "may be ex-library", etc. If the seller does not know these things with certainty it means the seller is a bookjacker and does not own or possess this book.

2. Condition: "Collectible, like new." "Used, good." "Acceptable", etc. The book description should be more than 1 or 2 cryptic lines and it should be very precise, indicating that the bookseller actually has possession of the book and can directly assess and describe its condition.

3. NEVER purchase an expensive fine or private press book on amazon.com. No exceptions.

https://www.librarything.com/topic/305075

Yeah, I'm aware of the differentiation, I was just saying that I've been collecting 1st editions, and now I want to step into the world of fine/private press books. There's a lot for me to learn, though. It's like a niche within a niche.

I might cheat a little and give more than just 2 or 3 works.

- Lost Horizon (James Hilton)
- Anything by Thomas Ligotti
- Anything by Robert Aickman
- The Seven Pillars of Wisdom (TE Lawrence)
- Histories (Herodotus)
- The Tomb of Tutankhamen (Howard Carter)

>10 HiroProtagonist9: The Tomb of Tutankhamen - Folio Society released a fabulous two volume edition of this work a couple years ago and should be easily found on ebay. It's not letterpress but it really is fantastic. It was one of their "fine" editions.

I love your username by the by. I picked up a first edition of Snow Crash this year in great condition and it is one of my most treasured books.

>10 HiroProtagonist9:
Tartarus Press has published some nice editions of Robert Aikman — not letterpress, but worth a look.

>9 dlphcoracl:
Never purchase on Amazon? Hmm. Some years ago I bought, from an Amazon seller, the Allen Press edition of Rappaccini’s Daughter, brand new in the original wrapping paper, at a fair price. Presumably the exception that proves the rule, as a French friend of mine likes to say. :-)

That really is a lovely two volume edition. After a quick look, it seems a bit hard to find. No copies on ebay, and only two on abebooks, with wildly different prices and one doesn't have a picture. I'll set up alerts. Hopefully, I can snag one at some point in the near future.

Thanks, Snow Crash is one of my favorite novels and I've always wanted a first edition. They're still surprisingly affordable, as far as first editions go. If you don't mind, can you tell me how much you paid for your copy? I feel like it's a book whose value will appreciate well over time.

I'll check them out, thanks. Doesn't seem like many Aickman books have gotten the fine press treatment.

>13 kermaier:

That was indeed the exception. Amazon.com is littered with fraudsters, more so than any other site I am aware of.

>16 dlphcoracl: Where there is money and high volume, so also there is fraud.

>17 ultrarightist:

Amazon.com is fine for paperbacks and trade books. For anything over $100, look elsewhere.

>9 dlphcoracl: I bought a Fine copy of an LEC for $5 on Amazon after another LT member had successfully bought an LEC from this same seller. Never say never.

Unlike some others' recommendations, I find it exciting to buy books that I've never heard about. I usually find out about these books by reading LT threads or member's blogs but even without those there have been many LEC purchases or even pulp/noir fiction from Jerad that I enjoyed reading but really knew nothing about before.

As a beginner I'd concentrate on the lower priced end of fine book collecting and read the bargain threads on this group and the Macy group.

>18 dlphcoracl:
Probably another exception, but, a few years ago, I purchased a gorgeous specially bound Golden Cockerel edition in a perfect shape for a very low price from one of Amazon sellers.
I would not state never purchase fine books on Amazon so categorically. I remember several people on this and other forums getting very lucky on Amazon.
For me personally that purchase was an exception, as I almost never look for fine books on Amazon, and when I do, some offering do seem "fishy".

Outside of the dark coronavirus and online only times we're in, where do you all search for fine press books, and how successful are you finding good deals?

Generally, I would search estate/garage sales, salvation army, and used books store for first editions, since a lot of them look unassuming and can slip through the cracks. Good condition fine press books look a little more impressive, though, so I imagine it may lead people to check the prices on them online before selling.

I'd love to hear any stories on rare finds, or any tips you have. The replies here have been very informative.

You may also find some useful advice on the Fine Press wiki -
https://wiki.librarything.com/index.php/Groups:Fine_Press_Forum#Fine_Press_Forum...

>1 HiroProtagonist9: There are also a number of threads on this forum you should check out. They can guide you to books you may wish to own but have never heard of.

>23 Glacierman:

Thanks for the tip! I’ve been reading everything I can, but there’s so much to absorb, and I’ve only just learned how to reply to a specific person.

The problem now is that there are too many books I want. Far too many.

>24 HiroProtagonist9:
Welcome to bibliomania - it is incurable!

>24 HiroProtagonist9:

So many books, so little time, so little money.....

Why does this sound all too familiar to me?? :-)

>24 HiroProtagonist9: Joining us won't help, but hey, we're all mad here... ;)

>25 wcarter:

I’ve always been tiptoeing around the periphery, but all of that was just a gateway to the “gentle” addiction that is fine/private press books.

>26 dlphcoracl:

I’ve already got a list of twenty-five reasonably (which is relative) priced books, along with a half dozen alerts set. My list of books in the tiers above reasonably priced is what’s really got me excited, though. Sort of a lifetime checklist. A bucket list might be a better name for it.

>27 RATBAG.:

It’s like an addict living with drug dealers! Lovely, goat skin drugs.

>28 HiroProtagonist9:

There is a saying about someone in imminent danger or peril being "up to his ass in alligators" and in your case I believe you are "up to your ass in Want List books", certainly a peril of sorts - if not to your immediate person, to your checking account and net worth. May I suggest you keep your eye on my sporadic articles entitled 'Affordable Treasures and Pleasures' which feature books (mostly trade books) with marvelous illustrations and user-friendly cost (almost always under $100). Also the recent discussion under "Best Fine Press Books for Under $100" contains some marvelous suggestions that won't wreak havoc on your bank account.

>1 HiroProtagonist9:

Make up your mind what interests you the most:

-nice readable editions of works that you want to read and reread?

-books as an artform and as collectible antiques?

Acquire a few and always strive for the best conservation grades. This is important, not only for your own pleasure, but in case your interest changes and you want to sell your books to be able to acquire others.

Read as much as you can about other collectors and book history in books rather than on the internet.

The problem reading LT posts only is that several of the persons who write the most are not really experts and suffer from tunnel vision.

You have members of another LT group who only collect books from one publisher, a publisher that nowadays prints in Slovakia and China. One cannot criticise that stunning publisher without being attacked. It is understandable, because who can accept that he has been living a lie for decades?

In another group, you are not welcome to write even about a successor at the publisher that the group is devoted to, because the creator of the group will post that he founded the group to the honour of the founder of the publisher, and "please don't write about other things…by the way, fart(h)ing, do you remember what fun we had at the movies during WWII?".

And then we have an expert that many newbies look up to who suddenly revealed what a renaissance man he is by asking how thin a piece of wood would have to be to be called paper!

No, read books about books and try to form your own judgment. There are thousands and thousands of interesting fine books out there, many of them unjustly forgotten. Do not wait for someone else to say that "this is great art" but trust yourself. Too many collectors don't.

>29 dlphcoracl:

A lot of the books from my list are from your affordable treasures postings on here and the ones on booksandvines, plus that under $100 thread. I’ve picked up The Song of Roland and Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard (both LEC), based on those recommendations. I’ll probably get a copy of A Journal of a Tour to the Hebrides this weekend. My first larger purchase will likely be Leaves of Grass (Peter Pauper Press) or Gertrude Bell’s The Arab War (Golden Cockerel), though I may wait to try and find a copy of the latter in person.

>30 artisanal:

I think both of those choices interest me. While I will likely always be keeping an eye towards replacing copies of the books I love with fine press editions, my personality is that of a collector. I can appreciate a book just for its beauty, and there are very few books that I wouldn’t read. Ideally, I would wait until I’ve read a new book before I purchase another book I haven’t read, unless a deal is just too good to pass up.

Can you suggest books I should read that deal with book/collecting history? I started A Gentle Madness last night, and I also picked up a used copy of Used and Rare: Travels in the Book World. I plan on picking up a copy of ABC for a book Collectors, and I’ve seen Collected Books: A Guide to Value, and On Paper mentioned.

I’ve really only explored the fine press portion of LT, so I don’t know much about the rest of the subforums or their users.

It’s difficult to start collecting during a pandemic. The internet of course makes it easy, but actually going out and finding books in the wild is the most appealing part of this to me, especially if I can find good deals. For now, I’m just trying to educate myself as much as possible, so that I won’t overlook books when I can finally start hunting.

>31 HiroProtagonist9:
The Limited Editions Club produced high quality fine editions from 1929 to 2009, with limitations that were usually between 1500 and 2000 copies. In the latter years the limitation number dropped to about 300 and they became far more expensive after George Macy was succeeded by Sidney Schiff as the owner. Their books can often be found at very reasonable prices on the secondary market.
If you are interested in these books you should obtain a copy of the History of the Limited Editions Club written by Carol Grossman and published by Oak Knoll Press.
Oak Knoll also sell fine press editions from other publishers and it is worthwhile subscribing to their regular emails of new and interesting titles that are for sale.

>32 wcarter: This is worth reading whether or not you desire to collect LEC books as it's a fantastic history that stands on it's own.

>32 wcarter:

>33 Sorion:

Thanks for the suggestion! A lot of my reading is history based, and this sounds like just the thing to fuel my new hobby.

>31 HiroProtagonist9:

Two private press books pertaining to book collecting that may be of interest:

1. The Invisible Collection, Stefan Zweig, Ursus Books, 2007. Written by Zweig over one hundred years ago, this is a private press edition commissioned and sold by NYC bookseller Ursus Books/Peter Kraus, printed by Koch Editions in San Francisco.

https://www.ursusbooks.com/pages/books/138779/stefan-zweig/the-invisible-collect...

2. Books and the Quiet Life by George Gissing (Chosen by W.R.B.), Thomas B. Mosher, 1914.

> 32 wcarter; >HiroProtagonist9:
I just have to share how satisfying it has been finding LEC books in reasonably good condition. In my view, this is the best starting point for fine/private press exploration. I started out with the Heritage Club out of Connecticut reprints of the original Heritage Press offshoot of the LEC. These seemed so wonderful to me until I began to examine the LEC originals. If you do look at Heritage Books, go for the New York issues; these were published by the original LEC.

I thank HiroProtagonist for starting this thread because it is such a good opportunity to discuss the appeals of this avocation. Thanks to all the contributors, but especially >dlphcoracl (I hope I don't sound like a toady) who has been of great help to me.
I just want to add to his suggestions this. I am unlikely to buy a new edition from one of these private presses. The price seems just too high generally; it will have to be a title or treatment I can't resist. This is especially so when there are so many "finds" on e-bay and maybe at a bookseller of older books. I admit I often buy books for their curiosity value and sometimes a book that no one else seems to want. I was lucky to get Gissing's book mentioned in >35 dlphcoracl: through idle surfing.
Certainly Nick Basbanes' books are great, especially "A Gentle Madness". But the ORIGINAL is Thomas Didbin's "Bibliomania or Book Madness" I have it leather bound, a rebinding by Sangorski & Sutcliffe of the 1876 edition. I have never confessed the price to my wife.
Anyway, the odd items one can come across are often the most rewarding.

>37 laotzu225: You’ve sagely hit upon rule #1 of book collecting. Never confess the price to your wife!

>29 dlphcoracl:
I am probably alone here or in a severe minority to think that hunting "affordable treasures", of which there is a legion, and buying many low-price undervalued fine press books will actually "wreak havoc on your bank account" and might prevent one from purchasing a book one really wants when it matters.
Assuming, of course, that one has limited resources.

It is much better to focus on books and publishers that you really want or deciding on a strategy/creating a vision of a collection one wants to build. It could be a collection of samples from as many fine press publishers as possible, or collection of only leather-bound editions, or LEC, or a mixture of the above, or anything else; however, buying all books that seem like bargains is not a good strategy, in my opinion. Again, assuming that one has limited budget, regardless of what the limit is.

That said, I enjoy the posts about beautiful books and information in these posts.

>39 booksforreading:

I see where you're coming from, and I think I will eventually follow your advice since I don't have unlimited resources. That being said, I've set aside a specific fund inside my budget to jumpstart my collection. I could buy 1-2 books with that fund or I could buy 15-20, so it's just a matter of deciding what I really want. I don't have any particular specialization in mind. I really like books in the lost world genre, and historical books on exploration from the 19th and early 20th century. I haven't been able to find a lot of fine press books that match my taste, though I did find a nice version of King Solomon's Mines by The Imprint Society.

In lieu of have a particular focus, I'm just going to start by replacing books I love with fine press editions and then go from there. Spending that initial fund on as many books as possible, especially if they're quality books at a good value, doesn't seem like too bad of an idea, initially. Then, I can measure new purchases against my monthly budget and be more judicious about my purchases, so that I won't end up running out of allotted funds when I find a book I really want.

>37 laotzu225:
>39 booksforreading:
>40 HiroProtagonist9:

One of the most important and underrated aspects of being a serious book collector is that it is a reflection of oneself, an extension of your personality. There is no right way or wrong way to collect fine & private press books if you collect books that speak to you, regardless of price. The Affordable Treasures and Pleasures articles are meant to be a change-up and were never intended for anyone to make a steady diet of these book to the point where they "might prevent one from purchasing a book one really wants when it matters." Stated a bit differently, every book you purchase cannot be a Kelmscott Press or Ashendene Press book and an inexpensive book with a unique twist, e.g., a marvelous read, exceptional illustrations, etc. is an important part of ANY collection.

>41 dlphcoracl: "One of the most important and underrated aspects of being a serious book collector is that it is a reflection of oneself, an extension of your personality."

Indeed. I think it takes at least several years of serious book collecting for one to appreciate this about oneself.

>42 ultrarightist:
Agreed. I wouldn’t call myself a “serious” collector yet, but there are quite a few early purchases that have been left behind by my evolving tastes and interests.

>43 kermaier: Same. It's part of the natural evolution of collecting and taste. When I started collecting, I was overly focused on leather covers, acquiring EP and Franklin Press books. While I am loathe to part with my FP full leather books (they used good quality leather and the binders knew their craft), I have jettisoned almost all of my EP books. I learned to appreciate other fine materials for and a wider variety of quality bindings. And once the the letterpress bug bit, well, that was a game changer. And then wood block illustrations. And then mould-made and handmade papers. And then...

>44 ultrarightist: Same here. When I started I was just going after everything willy nilly with little thought to what I would actually read and desire to build a collection around for the long term. After selling/giving away most of those I have a smaller and much more focused collection now that I’m a lot more careful with and make additions much more judiciously.

EDIT: I should add the mistakes were largely due to this group and the improved habits are largely thanks to this group. As well as FS Devotees of course.

>44 ultrarightist: ultrarightist
Once I learned that so many of the EP books (that I was interested in) were Heritage Press or Club reprints, I quickly lost interest and have rarely bought any.
And there are so many other appealing bindings than leather.

The Imprint Society published several gems, most of which are quite affordable.

I would like to throw my specialty press into the mix: MidWorld Press.
https://midworldpress.com
I'm a collector myself and a fan of many of the other publishers mentioned previously.

>35 dlphcoracl: Perhaps a dated reply, but if you like Books and The Quiet Life you really should get it in its full edition The Private Papers of Henry Ryecroft. This was Gissing's last novel before he passed away and, to me, head and shoulders his best. B&TQL is a distillation from the latter, and created as such by Mosher for a specific series of books, all following a similar vein. Other works in the series were by Hiaire Belloc and James Douglas. Strangely, Ryecroft was also one of the last books Mosher published prior to his death in 1923. I was fortunate to find a Van Gelder paper copy with the autograph of Frank Swinerton in it, who was, known to Gissing and subsequently his biographer.
If you like books, TPPHR is really something you should read.

>49 JJKEarl:

Yes, it's a very engaging work to some temperaments, my own included, and a short book in its fullness. I didn't know a selection had been published. I can't vouch for other editions, but the one I have is a Constable reprint from 1912, linen spine, brown paper boards and printed on laid paper by the Arden Press, Letchworth: apparently just a trade copy, but far above most trade editions in design and production, almost the equal of a Medici Society book from the period.

Much solid advice above. There are so many fine presses out there worth collecting. One thing I've typically suggested in beginning a collection is to look at the historical presses in your state/city/locale, etc., as part of your collecting strategy. There are so many interesting and well crafted books that can be found with a local angle that don't cost an arm and a leg. This can also help you learn about markets, the craft and condition with the inevitable mistakes not causing too much pain. Not every book needs to be numbered/lettered or cost five figures to be worthwhile. Good hunting to you!

>51 dpbbooks: "Not every book needs to be numbered/lettered or cost five figures to be worthwhile."

Hear, hear.

>51 dpbbooks: >52 ultrarightist: Agree as well. Case in point for me: I live in California and have picked up several publications from Grabhorn Press that are fantastic (covering early CA) and amazingly cheap.

>53 LBShoreBook: Not to mention The Book Club of California!

The longer I spend learning about fine books, the more interesting books I learn about and the longer is the list of books I need to own (right now!). Does anyone have any strategies for prioritising or quelling the urge to just buy everything, other than the points above? Even having narrowed down my interests, there's so much!

>55 ubiquitousuk:
Buy the Kindle edition. If you like it, find a nice printed edition that you would like to add to your permanent library. If you don’t like it, you’ve learned something about yourself and the book, and you aren’t out much money.

>55 ubiquitousuk: My bank account takes care of that problem for me. I either save to get a book I REALLY like or I impulse buy something filthy cheap. Keeps the dilemmas to a tiny minimum.

>55 ubiquitousuk:
Most active members of this forum today seem interested primarily in the physical attributes of a book and/or in its investment potential, but I’m an old-fashioned collector who values its contents above all else. You will have to decide which kind of collector you want to be. >57 Glacierman: has the right idea.

I think the "physical attributes" such as paper used, illustrations, cover, etc. are all what set fine press apart from mass-market books. I do agree however that in general "investment potential" while interesting does not make a book. You can find many beautiful letterpress editions for incredible (low) prices. That said, some prices have really gone up over the past few years, but in general many volumes from the Limited Editions Club and similar presses can be had for excellent prices.

>59 astropi:
It is true that beautiful illustrations and attractiveness on a shelf are important to me, though not as important as the written content. Collectors will differ as to the weight allotted to each attribute.

I don’t regret many purchases, but one that still grates on me was a gorgeous and expensive 3-volume edition of “War and Peace” from Franklin Library. I’m not a big fiction reader, but I had always thought I should read that one because of its fame and respect among the scholarly elite. I did manage to finish it, but I hated every minute. I really did not need to know 150 pages worth about wolf hunting in 19th century Russia. This was a case for which I should have followed my own advice to get a Kindle edition first. Dare I tackle “Ulysses” next?

I am a lover of the "Art of the Book" in that the paper, illustrations, layout, typeface, binding, slipcase, page edges and general presentation are very important to me, but I will not buy a book that I do not want to read.

>61 wcarter:
Perfect. The best advice yet!

>60 jroger1: ...I really did not need to know 150 pages worth about wolf hunting in 19th century Russia....

You may just have tipped me into reading the copy of War and Peace I bought roughly 40 years ago, I had no idea there was anything to speak of about wolf hunting in it. Not that I've any particular interest in wolf hunting, or hunting, or wolves, you understand... no, that's the wrong expression, because I'll be surprised if anyone understands, and there's no reason why they should. I only have the little Oxford World's Classics edition, so if I'm going to read it I should do so soon before my eyesight deteriorates any further.

>61 wcarter:

Full agreement from me as to that: I would have to say too that I'm not easily put off buying a book I do want to read, and often there aren't many physically appealing options. Occasionally I'm spoilt by having a number of finely produced editions to select from at prices that aren't too fierce, more often I'm hoping one half decent copy of a text published a century ago will turn up for sale.

Thanks all: I fully agree that it makes sense to buy stuff you've the intention to "read" (where reading is interpreted liberally to also include the carefully study of books of engravings, etc.)

For reading fiction and other long-form material, I don't have a big problem: I am mostly content with the likes of Folio Society or LEC, which are affordable enough that I will exhaust available reading time long before available book budget.

My main problem is the private press and livre d'artiste stuff that I can get through in an (exceptionally pleasant) afternoon but can't afford to buy at the rate of ten a month. It can be hard to find more than a picture or two of these books online, so one is often buying blind. There therefore seems to be the need for some mechanism for determining, at the very least, which order to buy these unknown quantities in. So far, my principles are

- First buy books that are less likely to show up on the market again soon over those that are widely available.
- Most of the time, it's better to buy one truly exceptional book than two merely good ones.
- Have a focus (whether on one or two publishers, a time period, an artist, a genre, etc.) and use it as a way to avoid getting distracted.
- Always have a reserve budget in case the book you really want comes onto the market unexpectedly.
- Most of the time, buy books you are confident you'll like in preference to ones you might like (but not always, because serendipity is a thing).
- Resist the urge to buy if the only reason would be that the book seems like a good deal relative to historic market prices.
- Resist the urge to overpay just because you want a book -- there are plenty more books to spend your money on and the chance to buy will come round again eventually.
- Keep lists of books you want to buy. It's easier to think clearly about this before the book comes onto the market and FOMO starts confusing you.
- Take advice from LibraryThing members on books not to miss.

Edit to say that having these rules is one thing, sticking to them is quite another. Hopefully, writing them down is a good reinforcement mechanism!

Reading the various comments above leads to one inescapable conclusion:

You are making something inherently pleasurable far too difficult.

>63 terebinth: “I'll be surprised if anyone understands…”

Are you a werewolf?

>61 wcarter: Very much agree. Stay with the contents being the fulcrum and everything else happy vectors from it.
Good luck!

Really enjoyed reading this thread. I'm not a new collector by any means, but the variety of advice is still always very insightful. One thing which I didn't hear and which I actually never hear mentioned on this forum: Libraries. Most public and university libraries have special collections which are accessible to all. Some – like, for example, the New York Public Library – have near complete collections of several major private presses. You can request to view them at your leisure in their reading rooms. I've been able to spend time with almost the entire Arion Press catalogue despite only owning four Arion Press books because of public libraries.

And although this is the "Advice for a New Collector" thread, a suggestion for established collectors: Consider leaving your collection to a library/university when the time comes! This way it'll be well taken care of, and accessible to readers, collectors, curators, researchers, everyone thereafter.

I'm a newbie and not even a total "convert" yet, but certainly soaking up as much as I can from the gracious members of this forum.

>68 grifgon: That public libraries house collections of private presses is a total revelation to me. I'll have to see what's in my neck of the woods.

>69 maisiedotes: You aren't alone. Few people realize this, I think!

My local library system — Multnomah County Library, anchored in Portland, only the country's 27th most populous city — is hardly one of the famous or great libraries in the world, and yet it has a very respectable special collections containing hundreds of fine press books.

https://multcolib.org/library-location/john-wilson-special-collections

"The book arts collection includes manuscripts as early as the 13th century and as recent as just-published fine press editions by regional book artists. There are also numerous incunables (books printed before 1501), including books printed by some of the most well-known early printers, such as Aldus Manutius, Robert Estienne, Peter Schoeffer and two copies of Anton Koberger's Nuremberg Chronicle, long recognized as one of the earliest important illustrated printed books. Books noteworthy for their bindings, paper or typography; unusual books; and important books of the private press movement, including a large collection devoted to the Doves Press, and the only copy in the Northwest United States of the Kelmscott Chaucer (1896) are also here."

Not bad for a local yokel library!

>70 grifgon: I wonder if they provide a pair of gloves for their visitors! :D Impressive collection!

I would also like to ask you all a question. There's a book that I really really want to get but it is rare to find it in at least very good condition. I've been following the market for at least half a year now (not that long, I know) and no additional copies have shown up yet. There is one copy which for me qualifies as VG but it comes without a slipcase (which is a bit of a red flag for me as slipcases protect poor packaged books during their looong journey through seven seas, you get it...). Should I pull the trigger on said copy, or is it wise to wait longer? There's always a chance someone will buy it...

>71 Lukas1990: I'd likely buy it. You could try asking the seller to insure the shipment if you are worried about shipping damage. And, assuming the price is fair, if a better copy ever comes on the market you can probably sell this one and get your money back.

>60 jroger1:
Your reaction to War and Peace reminds me of my reaction to Ulysses. I have tried to read it several times. I have listened to about ten chapters being read.

My conclusion: leave it to those who are, or think they are, "scholarly elite".

>60 jroger1: >73 pgmcc: I think War & Peace is an engrossing novel – a total page turner. Haven't read all of Ulyssses yet but it does strike me as a bit more of a shlog if you aren't "into it".

>74 grifgon:
Yes, I agree. You have to be, "into it".

I have not read War and Peace but have never had a bad experience reading any Russian literature, so it is not off the table.

>73 pgmcc: I've read both War and Peace and Ulysses. War and Peace is remarkably easy to read. Ulysses is much more difficult - but I think ultimately more satisfying. I have the Thornwillow half-leather coming and plan an eventual reread after reading my LEC Dubliners (excellent production) - I've only read The Dead previously -as well as rereading Portrait (any recommendations for a fine press version?). The first read of Ulysses was a slog but I anticipate a reread will be more enjoyable.

>76 punkzip:

Sadly, there are no truly top-notch editions of 'Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man.' The only fine & private press edition is the LEC, which is a very mediocre, uninspired offering.

>76 punkzip:
I loved the stories in Dubliners. Sorry, no recommendations for a fine press version.

War and Peace was my gateway to the world of "nice books." Early in the pandemic, I decided it was high time to read this epic. I bought it in an Easton edition, which led eventually to this forum.

>70 grifgon: The special collections at your library make my heart flutter. A cursory glance at the website for San Francisco Public didn't name such gems, but I probably just need to dig deeper.

The ABAA California International Antiquarian Book Fair is in mid-February in Oakland, California and I am planning to go. It will be my first book fair ever and I'm nervous and excited. Any advice from the seasoned collectors?

>79 maisiedotes: "It will be my first book fair ever and I'm nervous and excited. Any advice from the seasoned collectors?"
Not really, it's a lot of fun and most of the sellers are nice and fun to talk to. The Oakland Marriott City Center is very easy to get to using BART.

Note CODEX is in town this year April 10 - 13 in Richmond at the Craneway Pavilion (a little harder to get to but plenty of free parking).

>80 kdweber: Thanks, I do plan to take BART.

Codex! Also a new event for me. Thanks for the alert. I'll check it out.

>79 maisiedotes: The San Francisco Public Library has an amazing rare books collection. It is on the 6th floor.
https://sfpl.org/locations/main-library/book-arts-special-collections#
The North Beach Branch on Columbus also has a nice (albeit small-ish) collection of Beat literature and related ephemera.
https://sfpl.org/locations/north-beach

The University of San Francisco also has a very fine rare books collection.
https://guides.usfca.edu/special-collections

And nearby, both the Stanford University collection (Bender Rare Books Room) and the UC Berkeley collection in the Bancroft Library are amazing treasures.
https://library.stanford.edu/spc/rare-books-division/about-rare-books-stanford
https://library.stanford.edu/libraries/green/bender-room
https://www.lib.berkeley.edu/libraries/bancroft-library/rare-books-collection

See also the Sperisen Library at the Book Club of California headquarters on Sutter.
https://www.bccbooks.org/library/

>82 dpbbooks: Wow, so much to explore. Thank you!

When I was a student at Berkeley, I was told the Bancroft Library had some pretty special books, but it never occurred to me to go look at them. I wasn't interested in fine books at that time. I'd appreciate college so much more if I went back now!

The rare books section of the William Robertson Coe Library at the University of Wyoming was where I first became acquainted with Kelmscott Press books and other press books. And a few illuminated manuscripts. Academic libraries are a resource not to be ignored.

>72 ubiquitousuk: Thank you, sounds reasonable!

San Francisco Public Library has the following event on February 12: "10th Annual Valentine's Day Broadside Printing. Experience letterpress printing on the Library's 1909 Albion handpress and take home a unique keepsake for your Valentine."

I'd be interested in seeing this Albion handpress in action—too bad the event is on the same day as the California International Antiquarian Book Fair!

>85 Lukas1990: It looks like you are finding all kinds of treasures out there. Nice!

>86 maisiedotes: And it looks like there's a lot of interesting events in your area! Maybe they'll even let participants actually use the handpress.

>80 kdweber: I went to the California International Antiquarian Book Fair last weekend. It was quite thrilling to see sellers whose names I recognized from the internet. I felt like I was in the presence of celebrities.

The sellers were indeed friendly and I didn't feel snubbed for being a not-yet-collector.

Are you generally allowed to touch the books at the antiquarian fair?

Not knowing the unspoken rules, I always asked first, and the sellers always gave permission. Only at one booth did I start looking at an item while the seller was engaged in a conversation. Her interlocutor nodded in my direction, and the seller raced over to offer to take the book (not old or fragile by any means) off the shelf for me. She kept it in her hands the whole time. I don't know if she was doing me or herself a favor. She was very congenial, though, and told me all about the book. When I came home and looked at the catalog, I learned that the price was $35,000.

>88 maisiedotes: Congratulations on your first book fair! I'm glad to hear that you had a good experience!

Good question about book-handling etiquette. The booths usually have open shelving and display case areas with doors that may be open, partially open, or closed. You can handle anything on the open shelves without asking permission. For books in the glass display cases, even if the doors are wide open, I would ask. You can make a general inquiry, such as, "May I look at these books?" and the seller will usually agree. As you are a beginning collector, you want to engage the seller in conversation anyway. Most sellers will have prepared a list of the books they have brought and will have it available at the booth--you can ask for one and review it over a cup of coffee or glass of wine so that you can return to the seller later with better knowledge of what you are looking at. Some sellers will also make the lists available on their websites before the fair--so at least you will be aware that you are looking at a $35,000 book!

>89 Flaubie: Ah, that would explain it. The $35,000 book was in a glass case (with the doors open, and right next to a couple of $5,000 books). Next time I'll know to tiptoe around glass cases.

For anybody who has been to a book fair: I'd love to hear your stories!

I have an offer to buy The Descent of Ishtar, by Diana White, Eragny Press (1903) for a very good price which is still considerably high for me. The book is in similar condition like other available copies.

Does anyone own this book? Do you advice to buy it? I could get some more desirable books for the price but I am willing to sample this press. I prefer illustrated books and there is only a frontispiece in The Descent of Ishtar which makes me doubt...

If in doubt, don't!

>91 Lukas1990: I have The Decent of Ishtar and it is a delightful book. However, it is a slim volume and I purchased it to add to my Eragny collection - one of which is dedicated to Diana White by Esther and Lucien. I do not know much it would cost you, but if you can buy more "desirable" books for the price then my advice is to spend your funds on books that you know you will love. Eragny Press books are expensive but they do pop up at a low price from time to time so you can still sample this press in the future. C'est d'Aucassin et de Nicolete - also from 1903 - has a lovely coloured frontispiece and might be more to your taste. I have been obsessed by Eragny Press for many years but I could not afford to build my substantial collection at today's prices.

>91 Lukas1990:

https://booksandvines.com/2019/07/17/the-descent-of-ishtar-by-diana-white-eragny...

>92 wcarter: Sounds right... But then, there's buyers remorse.

>93 AndyEngraver: Thanks, the book isn't that exciting for all-round collectors, right? The price I'm offered is about 275 USD.

>94 dlphcoracl: That's the first place I checked for a review. Chris didn't seem excited about the book.

Ah, decisions, decisions.

>91 Lukas1990: I can't speak to the Eragny edition, but I have on several occasions sampled a press by buying one of its less expensive but less appealing editions. My feeling is that this was usually a mistake and didn't give me a good sense of the press' overall output. I think that if you want to sample Eragny it could be better to spend more on a work that really catches your fancy in the knowledge that you could resell it if you change your mind.

>96 ubiquitousuk: That's some very reasonable advice. Besides, after closer examination of photos I've noticed some flaws which may explain the lower price. Will pass on it.

Using this thread, might be useful for all. How to deal with an unresponsive auction house? I have some issues with shipping a book but both the shipping department and the headquarters of the auction house just don't answer my e-mails. I prefer not using my phone for transatlantic calls. Thanks!

>98 Lukas1990: Not directly useful advice in this case, but one thing to keep track of is how old the order is and what your financial institution's cutoff timeframe is on challenging payment for non-receipt of goods. You don't want to let the seller prevaricate until this window closes and the payment is a done deal. Sometimes initiating a challenge to the payment can also serve as a kick to the vendor to get back in touch with you. You can become a priority when you threaten to take your money back.

>98 Lukas1990: I've had this problem from a couple of U.S. auction houses (I'm in the states), once regarding shipping and the other involving a payment issue. I loathe phone-calls generally, but for those couple incidents, I broke down and called them. Each time, the problem was resolved immediately, with profuse apologies from them. Some auction houses are very good at emails (e.g., Swann, PBA, Forum), whereas others don't seem ever to check their emails!

>98 Lukas1990:

Are you referring to Leslie Hindman Auctioneers in Chicago?

>101 dlphcoracl: Yes. Had no problems communicating with them prior to the auction. On their website they stated that their Chicago location provides in-house shipping and packing, this was also confirmed by an e-mail from their representative, but when I won a book on a Chicago based auction and asked them if I can use their in-house services they dissapeared. No answer for 72 hours.

>102 Lukas1990:

Hindman Aiuctioneers is an auction house I am especially familiar with because they are in my State of Illinois. When I am bidding in one of their auctions, I will always have Ms. Gretchen Hause, their Director of Book Auctions, pull the lots of interest to me and I will visit and inspect them on a day I am traveling to Chicago. They are reputable and exceptionally pleasant to deal with.

Simply put, you need to call them directly to clarify this issue and I am certain it will be handled properly and promptly.

>103 dlphcoracl: "They are reputable and exceptionally pleasant to deal with".

Ermmm, not sure about that. They have definitely seen my e-mails, because now their website is changed and it says they provide in-house shipping and packing ONLY for watches and jewelry. Still no response to my requests! If I were them, I would reply as fast as I can and solve the matter imediately. I'm a post-Soviet guy and am used to such tricks, so I made a screenshot of their website and can easily prove they still claimed to provide in-house shipping and packing for books even after the auction in which I participated took place.

>104 Lukas1990: "I'm a post-Soviet guy and am used to such tricks, so I made a screenshot of their website and can easily prove they still claimed to provide in-house shipping and packing for books"

Hindman is a highly reputable auction house. If the hope is to receive your book, then I would not call them to accuse them of chicanery. There are any number of legitimate reasons that someone would fail to respond to an email within 72 hours. If it were me, I'd call them to ask for the shipping status of the book; clarification on their shipping policy (which is probably loaded with caveats, as is true of every auction house); and some resolution that still gets you the book.

Worst-case scenario if you're polite to auctioneers: you pay a little bit more for shipping.
Worst-case if you accuse them of malfeasance: blackballed.

>105 DenimDan: I didn't intend to let the auction house name be known until I was asked if it's THAT auction house.

The changes made to their website prove beyond reasonable doubt they've read all my e-mails. Still there is no response to my very polite questions and requests. They could have at least asked me to wait until they find a solution or just inform me that there was an error/they forgot to update their website/the representative was wrong about their shipping policies etc. etc. It is not about the book anymore. Can't think of any excuses for such behaviour. Why should I waste more money calling them?

Also, according to their newly updated website, all purchased property must be collected from their premises within seven business days following the last day of the auction. So time is running out.

Update: I've just received a ridiculous quote for in-house packing and shipping. No explanations or apologies for the delay. Not classy at all. Will use third-party shipping services. First and last time bidding on Hindman auctions and I advice others to avoid them.