Unwelcome Topics

The racist ranting continues on the Dystopian topic, http://www.librarything.com/topic/127481, and I wonder if we should ask Tim to do something about it. Tim has recently considered allowing some groups to have a more restrictive TOS and since there's already a group (Pro & Con) devoted to free-for-all political discussion I wonder if this group should be restricted to discussion of Progressive and Liberal views, as the name of the group implies.

Does it make sense to ask Tim to move the Dystopian topic to the Pro & Con group on the grounds that it's arguably on-topic there and off-topic here? Or should we just click the red x to ignore the thread?

I confess I have been poking the skunk on the other thread. The simple way to deal with it would indeed be to ignore it.

I wonder if this group should be restricted to discussion of Progressive and Liberal views

No. This is "a forum to discuss those books and authors which help to shape, change, mold, or support political and social values & beliefs." It's not "a forum for progressives and liberals to talk to themselves".

Besides, Romney's a progressive. He said so. http://slatest.slate.com/posts/2011/12/13/romney_2002_video_my_views_are_progres...

(P.S. The link in your post goes to a dormant thread in a deleted group.)

I am sure we want this in Pro and Con.

3> (P.S. The link in your post goes to a dormant thread in a deleted group.)

Thanks. The last digit got cut off when I copied and pasted but it's fixed now.

re #4: Can you "continue" a thread on to a different Group?

And are you serious, or are you being sarcastic? I can't tell.

I guess my feeling is that by placing the topic in this group the OP isn't being honest about wanting an open discussion but is instead just wanting to get a rise out of people. With the rate that she is cutting and pasting new posts I wouldn't be surprised to see it end up in Hot Topics.

> 7

You know, the best way to deal with trolls like that person is to ignore them. There is no point in engaging with them. They'll simply use your responses as an excuse to continue to spew their garbage. Let her talk to dead air.

I know that's the standard response. But there's something unsavory about giving someone an open mike to spew whatever hatred they want.

I decided to ignore the topic. I found the racist rants really distasteful.

I would like to know what most progressives consider to be a 'Racist.' Is someone who is convinced that there are real and significant differences in the capabilities of people of different races, and that these differences are measurable across a wide cross-section of people, a 'Racist' or is that person simply a 'Realist' (another "R" word)? We can be sure that someone who feels hatred or disdain for individuals solely due to their race can be considered a "Racist', but exactly how broad should the definition be? Unfortunately, the term has become something of a condemnatory pejorative all too often used to stifle discussion and imply that the individual who does not believe that 'All races are created equal' is a hate-filled and delusional person worthy unworthy of consideration or rational discussion.
Please respond with your views.

#11: I think racism requires an element of fearmongering. For such people it's not enough to make dubious claims about racial differences. She sees anyone who isn't lily-white as a threat to her way of life.

>11 JimThomson: Is someone who is convinced that there are real and significant differences in the capabilities of people of different races, and that these differences are measurable across a wide cross-section of people, a 'Racist' or is that person simply a 'Realist' (another "R" word)? We can be sure that someone who feels hatred or disdain for individuals solely due to their race can be considered a "Racist', but exactly how broad should the definition be?

"Convinced" on the basis of what? The biological literature is pretty clear that the genetic history of modern humans doesn't contain any non-trivial differentiation between populations, and the sociological literature is pretty clear that racial categories are cultural constructs whose dividing lines and significance vary between societies. Anybody convinced of the independent reality of races (which is necessary for there to be "real and significant differences" between them) is either poorly informed or obstinate.

To me, racism entails attributing a person's personal qualities to their 'racial' category, or assigning characteristic personal qualities to a 'racial' category. Anything that implies the existence of independently real races is racist. (I suppose one could call this 'weak' racism, with 'strong' racism being a disparaging attitude toward other 'racial' categories. But even so, 'weak' racism is no less pernicious than 'strong' racism because the 'weak' underpins the 'strong.')

1> I'm with Canadian_Down_Under -- just ignore the topic and get on with your life. Some people like abusive relationships, virtual and otherwise. Letting them indulge themselves doesn't mean you have to watch.

It is interesting to "reverse engineer" the poster in question's priviate library. Tag mirror connects with 66 of the 94...it sort of looks like you are what you read ...or maybe it is a case of you read what you are...

I'm not sure what you mean by "Tag mirror connects with 66 of the 94", but when I look at her tag mirror I'm not surprised that the biggest tag is Conspiracy.

Also, her profile says that she has a Public account but when I try to look at her library it says that it's private. Does anyone else see this?

Go over to the library and click on tag mirror and you will get the way other people tag the books in the collection. Click on the various tags and the books that have been cross referenced in other libraries under other tags will list. Run through the tag list by clicking on each tag and what you get are books in that library that are in at least one other library on the site and that have been tagged in some manner or other. There are 66 that have been tagged and referenced in at least one other library on this site.

From time to time I've looked at libraries that the search engine says are somewhat like mine only to find them marked private. In order to get some sense of why the search engine seems to think this I use the tag mirror to search the collection for possible interesting books. Several times I've turned up a real gem that I would never have known about otherwise.

Well, that's the end of this thread.

If there are no differences in races - how can someone be a racist?

By pretending and acting as if there are. Dimwit.

or they can be debunked and refuted.

They have been. Many times.

Aren't you being racist by attempting to exclude me from this thread!

No. No one is excluding you from the thread. What is being done is that your ideas are being repudiated and you are being ostracized for holding odious views. This is being done on the basis of what you have specifically said, not because of your race or any other personal characteristic other than your views.

You don't have to exclude me. I'm leaving so you boys can have you little club. Put a sign on the door "No Girls Allowed".

Nice flounce. I suspect that, just like the last time you flounced, you'll be back to posting in this thread in no time. After all, just about everything you say is a lie.

Nice try with the assumptions of everyone's gender.

You have even attempted to spy on the books I read...

No. If someone posts information to the internet, they then have to assume that the information is findable by others. The internet is a public place, which occasionally surprises people to learn.

And - as much as I don't want to engage your filthy ignorance - I'll just point out that America was diverse long before 1965.

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

This was true even back when your non-Anglo-Saxon immigrant ancestors came to this country and "took it away from the Founding Stock".