OT - Lyra's Books LE announcement
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1Fierylunar
Lyra's Books, known for rebinding many FS Lord of the Rings in excellent leather bindings, has just made an announcement on a Limited Edition he is planning to publish:
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/post/stardust
Letterpress, marbled end papers, gilded page edges, in slipcase or so lander box, and illustrated and signed by Charles Vess (and some also by Neil Gaiman himself), in 3 different versions (500 cloth, 100 numbered leather and 26 lettered). Knowing the quality of the books rebound, I cannot wait for further details. Knowing the price point Lyra's Books sell at, my bank account is filled with dread.
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/post/stardust
Letterpress, marbled end papers, gilded page edges, in slipcase or so lander box, and illustrated and signed by Charles Vess (and some also by Neil Gaiman himself), in 3 different versions (500 cloth, 100 numbered leather and 26 lettered). Knowing the quality of the books rebound, I cannot wait for further details. Knowing the price point Lyra's Books sell at, my bank account is filled with dread.
3SF-72
Do you know if those will be new illustrations? I think Vess already illustrated Stardust, though in a very different, much more 'regular' edition.
4gmacaree
>3 SF-72: Rich answered this on Facebook: "they will be new or unpublished illustrations 😊 a bit of a mixture. None from the original illustrated edition"
6wcarter
>5 Sorion:
But how much???
But how much???
7Sorion
>6 wcarter: AS MUCH AS IT TAKES!!!
Seriously though, that full leather binding with “stardust” in gold flake all over it, original illustrations, and printed letterpress is worth quite a lot. Not even counting in a Neil Gaiman signature to boot. Minimum 1200 I would imagine. I can see them trying to get 1800 for it. There is pretty much no way I could buy it at 1800 but I would try to find a way at 1200 or less even if I had to sell to buy.
Seriously though, that full leather binding with “stardust” in gold flake all over it, original illustrations, and printed letterpress is worth quite a lot. Not even counting in a Neil Gaiman signature to boot. Minimum 1200 I would imagine. I can see them trying to get 1800 for it. There is pretty much no way I could buy it at 1800 but I would try to find a way at 1200 or less even if I had to sell to buy.
9gmacaree
I'd be extremely surprised if the price is as high as >7 Sorion: is guessing. Lyra's Books produces very expensive work when he works on rebinding first editions/signed copies but I've found his pricing model to be relatively economical otherwise. Obviously letterpress and leather binding is not going to be cheap but I'm hoping it's affordable.
10Sorion
>9 gmacaree: I would hope you're right. I know nothing of them other then their stunning work rebinding LOTR books. My guesses are stricly based on what I think a private press book of that caliber would retail for. I know that the forthcoming Wind in the Willows from Mad Parrot Press will be retailing for 2000 dollars for 75 copies and I would be very surprised if that is more then a quarter leather binding.
11SomeKindOfStranger
Charles Vess has commented:
"The cover there will actually feature a drawing that will be stamped in foil. 10 interior color plates tipped in with tissue guards. No images will be reused from the original edition. Some will have been used in the Stardust deluxe print set, two will be finished from existing drawings and one will be entirely new. I think it will be gorgeous!"
"The cover there will actually feature a drawing that will be stamped in foil. 10 interior color plates tipped in with tissue guards. No images will be reused from the original edition. Some will have been used in the Stardust deluxe print set, two will be finished from existing drawings and one will be entirely new. I think it will be gorgeous!"
12gmacaree
Rich has an update on his site, with some photos of the prototype bindings and an expected pricing list:
Cloth edition – 500 copies @ £150 (£125 pre-order)
Leather edition – 100 copies @ £495 (£450 pre-order)
Lettered edition – 26 copies @ £1750 (£1550 pre-order)
Cloth edition – 500 copies @ £150 (£125 pre-order)
Leather edition – 100 copies @ £495 (£450 pre-order)
Lettered edition – 26 copies @ £1750 (£1550 pre-order)
15gmacaree
>14 wongie: Full leather with Gaiman's signature isn't a bad deal either. Would be tempted by the vellum but will have to economise during the pandemic
16Fierylunar
I prefer both the standard and leather over the lettered personally. The standard price is an absolute bargain and I feel the cops will show up at some point to arrest me for theft when I inevitably succumb to its charms. That leather edition is especially sumptuous, though a bit too expensive for my personal book budget. If he decides to use that binding for a His Dark Materials/Book of Dust set, that would settle it though.
17jsg1976
The lettered edition looks incredible, but also incredibly out of my price range. But the cloth bound version is very tempting.
18Raenas
He is taking non-paid reservations now for the Lettered and Leather editions. Drop an email to contact@lyrasbooks.com, state which edition you want, name and email. They are going fast so better hurry.
19Levin40
>18 Raenas: Thanks for letting us know. Put myself down for the leather edition which looks like it's going to be very special indeed.
21kdweber
>20 davelin: I have no idea but my guess would be around £30.
22jsg1976
Well, thanks to >18 Raenas:, I just FOMO’d myself into reserving a leather-bound copy
Edit: Looks like my FOMO was justified based on >28 SolerSystem:
Edit: Looks like my FOMO was justified based on >28 SolerSystem:
23davelin
>18 Raenas: I was also able to put my name down for the cloth version.
24SolerSystem
I just put my name down for the cloth, too.
28SolerSystem
Reservations are closed now. From Facebook:
Wow. OK.
I am astounded by the response to this. I'm not sure whether I'm just naive or if I just totally underestimated the audience for these books.
The leather edition is now almost totally gone. I am now closing the reservations for this edition as I'd like to leave some for the actual pre-order. I'm now fully aware that I didn't give much in the way of warning for this so I'd like to give other people who didn't see my post a fighting chance to grab a copy!
I'm sorry if this has caused problems. I just had no idea the response would be this huge! I expected a small handful of emails...!
Thanks for your interest!!!
Wow. OK.
I am astounded by the response to this. I'm not sure whether I'm just naive or if I just totally underestimated the audience for these books.
The leather edition is now almost totally gone. I am now closing the reservations for this edition as I'd like to leave some for the actual pre-order. I'm now fully aware that I didn't give much in the way of warning for this so I'd like to give other people who didn't see my post a fighting chance to grab a copy!
I'm sorry if this has caused problems. I just had no idea the response would be this huge! I expected a small handful of emails...!
Thanks for your interest!!!
30const-char-star
I also sprung for the leather edition. Too beautiful to pass up.
31SingingSands
Should have known not to wait and think about this with you vultures around ;-).
Oh well, hopefully I’ll be able to pick up a cloth version. Guessing if £450 for the leather bound volume made me pause for thought, then future resale prices will be well beyond me.
Oh well, hopefully I’ll be able to pick up a cloth version. Guessing if £450 for the leather bound volume made me pause for thought, then future resale prices will be well beyond me.
32Chemren
>31 SingingSands: He said he held some leather editions back for the actual pre-order. You can still get one if you are on your game in early June.
33SingingSands
>32 Chemren: thanks although I have a feeling they’ll go quickly.
35jsg1976
>34 coraline3: check out the explanation from Rich’s Facebook page posted in >28 SolerSystem:. This seems to have been very much naïveté, not malicious intent.
36c_schelle
>35 jsg1976: I missed the window by 30 minutes. I wish with this amount of demand he could make a sweepstake to determine who can buy the leather and lettered editions. This is my favourite method for such things, as nobody around the world is disadvantaged by their time zone or way of communication and there is no hurry later on. The drawback of this method is more work for the seller though.
37jsg1976
>36 c_schelle: he actually is going to run a small sweepstakes as sort of an apology, as well as give much more notice for when pre-orders actually open. From his FB page:
I'm very aware that my 'no warning' post about reserving books yesterday may have caused a lot of people to be disappointed. I am very sorry for that. As you know, I have already closed the reservations for the Leather edition. I will now have to close the reservations for all the rest too. There can't be a pre-order if there's no books left to sell!
Doing this without sufficient warning was an error on my part. I really didn't expect the huge response it got. This is the first time I've published and promoted a book like this and the pre-order process is still new to me. I am trying my best to rectify this and ensure that everyone has a chance of getting hold of one of the remaining copies. There are still some Leather editions left as well as most of the Standard Cloth. Also a few Lettered. These will now only be available when the pre-order comes around (some time in June). When I know the exact date I will give AT LEAST one weeks notice so that people who are interested can be prepared for it. Be assured, I have learned from yesterday!
I will also be doing a book giveaway very soon. Something like a prize draw. This will give people another (small) chance to own a copy. I will post more details on that later next week.
Have a great weekend everyone ❤️🌠
I'm very aware that my 'no warning' post about reserving books yesterday may have caused a lot of people to be disappointed. I am very sorry for that. As you know, I have already closed the reservations for the Leather edition. I will now have to close the reservations for all the rest too. There can't be a pre-order if there's no books left to sell!
Doing this without sufficient warning was an error on my part. I really didn't expect the huge response it got. This is the first time I've published and promoted a book like this and the pre-order process is still new to me. I am trying my best to rectify this and ensure that everyone has a chance of getting hold of one of the remaining copies. There are still some Leather editions left as well as most of the Standard Cloth. Also a few Lettered. These will now only be available when the pre-order comes around (some time in June). When I know the exact date I will give AT LEAST one weeks notice so that people who are interested can be prepared for it. Be assured, I have learned from yesterday!
I will also be doing a book giveaway very soon. Something like a prize draw. This will give people another (small) chance to own a copy. I will post more details on that later next week.
Have a great weekend everyone ❤️🌠
38coraline3
Lottery is usually best for these sorts of things, but I find few offer it due to the extra work involved. I did see the edition numbers earlier and felt that they were dangerously low at the prices they were offered at given what title was being sold.
39LYRASBOOKS
Hi guys, Rich from Lyra's Books here. I'm so sorry for all this confusion surrounding the reservations. I shouldn't have done it but didn't think it would get so crazy. I also should have had the foresight to stop taking those reservations a lot earlier.
What happened was that after I shared my blog post I started to get a lot of emails from people asking to reserve copies. Now, up until this point I had been a little worried (as a first time publisher with every penny he owns tied up in this) that I might not sell as many as I'd hoped. I guess it's that thing where you suddenly realise you're doing something massive and maybe it's not going to go the way you want. Anxiety! I've been pursuing this project for 2 years (!) and you have no idea how much I want this to succeed.
So I took those reservations very happily. It then occurred to me that it wasn't really fair on everyone else so in a moment of pure stupidity I offered the chance to do the same for everyone else. And I happily started to take those. The rest is history. It went nuts. And I can promise it won't happen again.
The question is - what now? You mentioned a lottery. Do you think this is a good way to go with the remaining copies? Open only to those who haven't already reserved a copy. I'm thinking of doing a poll on social media to see what people think about it. There are literally a handful of copies still available but I think this way it would give everybody an equal chance.
Let me know what you think. Cheers,
Rich
What happened was that after I shared my blog post I started to get a lot of emails from people asking to reserve copies. Now, up until this point I had been a little worried (as a first time publisher with every penny he owns tied up in this) that I might not sell as many as I'd hoped. I guess it's that thing where you suddenly realise you're doing something massive and maybe it's not going to go the way you want. Anxiety! I've been pursuing this project for 2 years (!) and you have no idea how much I want this to succeed.
So I took those reservations very happily. It then occurred to me that it wasn't really fair on everyone else so in a moment of pure stupidity I offered the chance to do the same for everyone else. And I happily started to take those. The rest is history. It went nuts. And I can promise it won't happen again.
The question is - what now? You mentioned a lottery. Do you think this is a good way to go with the remaining copies? Open only to those who haven't already reserved a copy. I'm thinking of doing a poll on social media to see what people think about it. There are literally a handful of copies still available but I think this way it would give everybody an equal chance.
Let me know what you think. Cheers,
Rich
40Raenas
>39 LYRASBOOKS:
Thanks for taking the time to comment, and I don't think anybody resents what you did - everything was done out of good will and the all so reasonable risk minimization of start-up enterprises.
Now, I would be cautious of a lottery, as in my experience many people tend to use fake email addresses to increase chances. One good way of ensuring some fairness is asking for details that are difficult to mass generate - best example is unique phone number! If the number of copies is low, then you can require all orders to be verified via phone/text. This way people cannot submit an application with 50 fake email addresses and such.
An ordinary release also has its merit as each person really only has one chance (unlikely they can or want to put multiple people on it), but it disadvantages people with slow internet speed and lower technical skills - hyped releases usually need pre-registered addresses and credit card details, which lots of people are unaware of and would lose their book while entering details. I strongly discourage solutions that hold the book in the basket for some time as it only leads people putting it into the basket, holding it and reselling it immediately (saw this happen, and really disheartening).
On balance, I recommend the lottery that requires details which are difficult to mass generate.
Thanks for taking the time to comment, and I don't think anybody resents what you did - everything was done out of good will and the all so reasonable risk minimization of start-up enterprises.
Now, I would be cautious of a lottery, as in my experience many people tend to use fake email addresses to increase chances. One good way of ensuring some fairness is asking for details that are difficult to mass generate - best example is unique phone number! If the number of copies is low, then you can require all orders to be verified via phone/text. This way people cannot submit an application with 50 fake email addresses and such.
An ordinary release also has its merit as each person really only has one chance (unlikely they can or want to put multiple people on it), but it disadvantages people with slow internet speed and lower technical skills - hyped releases usually need pre-registered addresses and credit card details, which lots of people are unaware of and would lose their book while entering details. I strongly discourage solutions that hold the book in the basket for some time as it only leads people putting it into the basket, holding it and reselling it immediately (saw this happen, and really disheartening).
On balance, I recommend the lottery that requires details which are difficult to mass generate.
41LYRASBOOKS
Thanks for the reply!
Yes I think a lottery is the way to go but I'm not sure how the phone/text thing would work? My first thought was to make an announcement on Facebook about it. I would then get any interested people to comment on the post to be added to the list (I'd cross reference these names to make sure they hadn't already ordered a copy). I guess some unscrupulous people could get friends or family to put their names down but I would hope they wouldn't or the risk of that was low. And at least its not as easy to do as using multiple email addresses
Yes I think a lottery is the way to go but I'm not sure how the phone/text thing would work? My first thought was to make an announcement on Facebook about it. I would then get any interested people to comment on the post to be added to the list (I'd cross reference these names to make sure they hadn't already ordered a copy). I guess some unscrupulous people could get friends or family to put their names down but I would hope they wouldn't or the risk of that was low. And at least its not as easy to do as using multiple email addresses
42Raenas
>41 LYRASBOOKS:
The disadvantage of Facebook is that many people actually don't have an account, and if there are lots of comments it will be a nightmare to process. The phone number works via a basic form people need to fill out: name, email address and phone number (sorry for not being able to give an example as not that well versed in tech, but as far as I know there are lots of standard solutions to set up a form). If they get selected for a copy, you send them a text to verify at the same time the notification email is sent. And how this works is that people won't be able to verify via fake number.
The disadvantage of Facebook is that many people actually don't have an account, and if there are lots of comments it will be a nightmare to process. The phone number works via a basic form people need to fill out: name, email address and phone number (sorry for not being able to give an example as not that well versed in tech, but as far as I know there are lots of standard solutions to set up a form). If they get selected for a copy, you send them a text to verify at the same time the notification email is sent. And how this works is that people won't be able to verify via fake number.
43LYRASBOOKS
True. I could do the same across Instagram and twitter but there will be some people who will only be able to deal with me via email. I will look into your suggestion.
The other option is to carry on as planned but open up a waiting list to everyone. If there are any cancellations then do a lottery from that list for who gets the books. But I suppose that poses the same risks.
The other option is to carry on as planned but open up a waiting list to everyone. If there are any cancellations then do a lottery from that list for who gets the books. But I suppose that poses the same risks.
44dlphcoracl
>39 LYRASBOOKS:
>41 LYRASBOOKS:
>43 LYRASBOOKS:
You DO realize that whatever method you decide upon to sell and distribute the remaining full leather and vellum binding copies of 'Stardust', this is a high class problem to have and it is a reflection of your superior craftsmanship and sincere interest in providing avid book collectors with wonderful books. There are certainly worse fates in life than having people clamor for your wares to a point that they are vastly oversubscribed. As someone once told me:
"Better than a sharp stick in the eye."
>41 LYRASBOOKS:
>43 LYRASBOOKS:
You DO realize that whatever method you decide upon to sell and distribute the remaining full leather and vellum binding copies of 'Stardust', this is a high class problem to have and it is a reflection of your superior craftsmanship and sincere interest in providing avid book collectors with wonderful books. There are certainly worse fates in life than having people clamor for your wares to a point that they are vastly oversubscribed. As someone once told me:
"Better than a sharp stick in the eye."
45ubiquitousuk
>39 LYRASBOOKS: Depending on how many copies you have left, you could just split them into two stacks and release one wave at 9am BST and a second wave at 5pm BST. That should cater to most, irrespective of time zone. If there's really a mad rush and it's first-come first-served then the result will be a de facto lottery anyway.
Also, I suppose it's too late (or perhaps ruled-out by your contract) to consider upping the limitation on at least the cloth-bound edition? It seems there might be the demand to support a larger print run.
Also, I suppose it's too late (or perhaps ruled-out by your contract) to consider upping the limitation on at least the cloth-bound edition? It seems there might be the demand to support a larger print run.
46LYRASBOOKS
Yes perhaps you're right.
I had considered seeing whether I could up the limitation on the leather editions by maybe 25-50 copies but in the end decided against it. I don't want people who had reserved those books to feel as though their copy had devalued in any way. Also, the extra work involved would be too much.
I think it probably just needs to be put down as a lesson learned and something to think about for next time.
Plus, an amendment to the contract could take quite a long time if my previous experience with them is anything to go by! I don't want to delay things any further. That is if they are even willing to amend it. Its possible they wouldn't.
I had considered seeing whether I could up the limitation on the leather editions by maybe 25-50 copies but in the end decided against it. I don't want people who had reserved those books to feel as though their copy had devalued in any way. Also, the extra work involved would be too much.
I think it probably just needs to be put down as a lesson learned and something to think about for next time.
Plus, an amendment to the contract could take quite a long time if my previous experience with them is anything to go by! I don't want to delay things any further. That is if they are even willing to amend it. Its possible they wouldn't.
47LYRASBOOKS
This is very true! I'm lucky to be having this problem I guess. Its not something I thought I would have to deal with for this project that's for sure!!
48c_schelle
>46 LYRASBOOKS: I couldn't reserve one unfortunately. I don't think upping the limitation number would devalue the book (at least for me). I think it's more about the craftsmanship than about low limitation numbers.
If there are not that many books left and the demand ist too high then this could also overwhelm your website and cause it to crash. You should definetly take precaucions for that case.
Either way there will be some disappointed people. I think it's very important now to communicate clearly what the process for buying the books will be.
If there are not that many books left and the demand ist too high then this could also overwhelm your website and cause it to crash. You should definetly take precaucions for that case.
Either way there will be some disappointed people. I think it's very important now to communicate clearly what the process for buying the books will be.
49DMulvee
You cannot increase the numbers, this will have been part of the reason why people decided to opt for them.
50treereader
>49 DMulvee:
I would really love to know the true count of people who really fall in that category. I think it's two. Maybe three.
I believe people want these books for the craftsmanship, not for the sake of an arbitrary, artificial limitation. Rich would certainly satisfy many, many more people than he would dissatisfy by opening up the limitation count.
I vote that he can and should, at least for the cloth bound version.
I would really love to know the true count of people who really fall in that category. I think it's two. Maybe three.
I believe people want these books for the craftsmanship, not for the sake of an arbitrary, artificial limitation. Rich would certainly satisfy many, many more people than he would dissatisfy by opening up the limitation count.
I vote that he can and should, at least for the cloth bound version.
51SF-72
>50 treereader:
I see it the same way and personally I couldn't care less about how many other people can enjoy a beautiful book. It doesn't lessen my own pleasure if many people can do so. I don't buy books for their re-sale value or rarity, which would be the only point where a low limitation would be a factor, in my opinion at least. But I can imagine that raising the limitation could be difficult with regard to the existing contract, and a lot of extra work, too.
I see it the same way and personally I couldn't care less about how many other people can enjoy a beautiful book. It doesn't lessen my own pleasure if many people can do so. I don't buy books for their re-sale value or rarity, which would be the only point where a low limitation would be a factor, in my opinion at least. But I can imagine that raising the limitation could be difficult with regard to the existing contract, and a lot of extra work, too.
52DMulvee
I didn’t order the book so don’t have a vested interest. Trying to claim to know the intention behind every other buyer is disingenuous and silly. I personally am indifferent to the number of copies that exist for a book.
However if the producer of this book tried to change the numbers now their reputation would be permanently damaged as people wouldn’t be able to trust them in the future. Ultimately they misjudged either the number of copies they should have made or the price point as demand has seemingly overwhelmed supply. This should allow them in the future to make adjustments to reduce the risk of this being repeated, but there is nothing they can do to mitigate what has happened here
However if the producer of this book tried to change the numbers now their reputation would be permanently damaged as people wouldn’t be able to trust them in the future. Ultimately they misjudged either the number of copies they should have made or the price point as demand has seemingly overwhelmed supply. This should allow them in the future to make adjustments to reduce the risk of this being repeated, but there is nothing they can do to mitigate what has happened here
53venkysuniverse
>52 DMulvee: I agree. Thornwillow press changes the number of full leather bound edition based on interest and I think that is not correct. I saw it recently on the Poe kickstarter campaign. Not that the number of copies matter to me, however it is wrong to pressure someone to purchase the last of the leather copies, only to realise a few days later that the count has been increased and that he/she need not have made a hurried decision.
54dlphcoracl
Two comments:
1. Richard cannot change or increase the number of copies in the limitations as initially stated for contractual reasons. Period.
2. Even if he were able to do so, the financial reward for creating dozens of additional copies with the inexpensive cloth bindings will not compensate sufficiently for the enormous amount of additional work it would entail. He has to earn a fair wage for his work and he also needs to involve himself with projects that are artistically stimulating. Creating another one hundred 'Stardust' books with cloth bindings does not qualify in that regard.
1. Richard cannot change or increase the number of copies in the limitations as initially stated for contractual reasons. Period.
2. Even if he were able to do so, the financial reward for creating dozens of additional copies with the inexpensive cloth bindings will not compensate sufficiently for the enormous amount of additional work it would entail. He has to earn a fair wage for his work and he also needs to involve himself with projects that are artistically stimulating. Creating another one hundred 'Stardust' books with cloth bindings does not qualify in that regard.
55treereader
>54 dlphcoracl:
I'm not sure I understand #2. Presumably, every copy is sold at a profit. If demand is so high than 500 clothbound copies is embarrassingly insufficient, it stands to reason that not only will all 500 will sell out, but that some larger set than 500 would also sell for a profit. The only additional work involved that doesn't scale economically with each copy produced (or not produced) is the one-time hit of amending any contracts necessary to produce more copies. I suppose there are human limitations...maybe Rich can't physically produce 5,000,000 copies, but another 100 seems within the realm of possibilities.
As for #1, any contract can be renegotiated. If some change turns out to be in the best interest for both parties, it's on the table.
I'm not sure I understand #2. Presumably, every copy is sold at a profit. If demand is so high than 500 clothbound copies is embarrassingly insufficient, it stands to reason that not only will all 500 will sell out, but that some larger set than 500 would also sell for a profit. The only additional work involved that doesn't scale economically with each copy produced (or not produced) is the one-time hit of amending any contracts necessary to produce more copies. I suppose there are human limitations...maybe Rich can't physically produce 5,000,000 copies, but another 100 seems within the realm of possibilities.
As for #1, any contract can be renegotiated. If some change turns out to be in the best interest for both parties, it's on the table.
56PeterFitzGerald
Ce message a été supprimé par son auteur
57LYRASBOOKS
Hi guys, I am happy with the limitation for the cloth bound version. Pretty much all of these are still available and so nothing changes really with the pre-order on that one.
It is the leather edition which has proved extremely popular and has caused the problems. So this is the one that would have the limitation increased, if at all.
Given the amount of division on the subject just on here, I suspect it will be less aggravating to leave it as it is and put it down as a lesson learned. And also to let the books be available only at pre-order and not do a lottery.
It is possible the publishers would increase the limitation if I asked, but it could take a long time for them to allow it. It took me 2 years to get to the point where I had contracts... I'm not saying it will take that long but you can see how quickly they work! I think the issue is that they are a huge business and I am, in the grand scheme of things, just a tiny little fish in a massive pond. I am at the bottom of the list when it comes to admin.
It is the leather edition which has proved extremely popular and has caused the problems. So this is the one that would have the limitation increased, if at all.
Given the amount of division on the subject just on here, I suspect it will be less aggravating to leave it as it is and put it down as a lesson learned. And also to let the books be available only at pre-order and not do a lottery.
It is possible the publishers would increase the limitation if I asked, but it could take a long time for them to allow it. It took me 2 years to get to the point where I had contracts... I'm not saying it will take that long but you can see how quickly they work! I think the issue is that they are a huge business and I am, in the grand scheme of things, just a tiny little fish in a massive pond. I am at the bottom of the list when it comes to admin.
58SingingSands
>39 LYRASBOOKS: Hi Rich, great to hear from you, comments for both you and others.
I missed out, but hey, you win some loose some. I have rare LE Folios such as Moby Dick, but missed out on Mort. Have some valuable standard editions such as Dark Is Rising, but will never complete the Fairy books. The last illustrates even on long running non-limited editions if the books are nice there will always be people who miss out. The problem is certain fan bases tend to take rejection more than others.
I feel there's three topics of conversation,
1) Increasing the number of volumes.
Don't do it.
There seem a lot of issues here, rewriting the contracts with the copyright owners which could take a while and delay the whole project, with no guarantee of success. Rather than more cash now, they might take a longer term view that brand scarcity and desirability are more important. Thus they could use this to take a bigger cut in future from other publishers.
I work in process engineering and scale up doesn't always mean you'll get the same or more profit margins. Sometimes you can make the most profit by doing smaller runs. It depends on the plant set up. Reading your blogs this doesn't appear to be your main job and is a side project. You have therefore worked out how much time it'll take you to do 100 and planned accordingly around, family, work, holiday, house renovations etc. Adding an extra 25 whilst not a lot, might mean that instead of publishing this side of Christmas it'll be July 2021, with all associated costs. Don't also forget you need a break!
Finally people will loose some trust in you,
2). Distribution of remaining volumes.
Lottery good idea, but emails really easy to make new accounts. A sci-fi obsessive former housemate, won multiple signed volumes years ago by spending the whole weekend creating fake gmail, hotmai, messenger. I have six genuine used email accounts, which I could submit.
A phone number would be better as much harder to game and I could only submit three. Although maybe Paypal user name and then only take payment from that account? Even more work to generate fake accounts.
3). Future editions, supply and demand.
Hushed breath (I've never read a Gaiman), but wanted this as a present for my wife, a big fan. She is quite big online and knows the sci-fi/fandom communities well. I showed her the pics and she wasn't surprised it sold out so quickly. But she thought the limitation numbers were the same as Folio LE's 750-1000, when I said 100 she laughed. This quality product, at this price point, will sell out every single time very quickly.
Increase limitation numbers - I think you could easily do this, make more money for yourself, but be careful not to over stretch yourself, and accept there will always be some disappointed people.
Increase price - for 100 leather bound you might have been able to charge £900/copy and still sell them quickly. However, that really narrows the demographic of buyers down and goes a little against the whole arts and craft movement and bringing fine products to the masses (well middle class in reality).
Keep it all the same - You may not have the free time to increase the number of volumes and maintaining other aspects of your life, and I would fully support this. Just accept there will always be people who miss out. I would do a first come first served, no pronouncement of the date, just some marketing on your blog that a new edition will be available in September. Those who check your site the most will notice when it's available and get first pick.
Apologies for the essay!
I missed out, but hey, you win some loose some. I have rare LE Folios such as Moby Dick, but missed out on Mort. Have some valuable standard editions such as Dark Is Rising, but will never complete the Fairy books. The last illustrates even on long running non-limited editions if the books are nice there will always be people who miss out. The problem is certain fan bases tend to take rejection more than others.
I feel there's three topics of conversation,
1) Increasing the number of volumes.
Don't do it.
There seem a lot of issues here, rewriting the contracts with the copyright owners which could take a while and delay the whole project, with no guarantee of success. Rather than more cash now, they might take a longer term view that brand scarcity and desirability are more important. Thus they could use this to take a bigger cut in future from other publishers.
I work in process engineering and scale up doesn't always mean you'll get the same or more profit margins. Sometimes you can make the most profit by doing smaller runs. It depends on the plant set up. Reading your blogs this doesn't appear to be your main job and is a side project. You have therefore worked out how much time it'll take you to do 100 and planned accordingly around, family, work, holiday, house renovations etc. Adding an extra 25 whilst not a lot, might mean that instead of publishing this side of Christmas it'll be July 2021, with all associated costs. Don't also forget you need a break!
Finally people will loose some trust in you,
2). Distribution of remaining volumes.
Lottery good idea, but emails really easy to make new accounts. A sci-fi obsessive former housemate, won multiple signed volumes years ago by spending the whole weekend creating fake gmail, hotmai, messenger. I have six genuine used email accounts, which I could submit.
A phone number would be better as much harder to game and I could only submit three. Although maybe Paypal user name and then only take payment from that account? Even more work to generate fake accounts.
3). Future editions, supply and demand.
Hushed breath (I've never read a Gaiman), but wanted this as a present for my wife, a big fan. She is quite big online and knows the sci-fi/fandom communities well. I showed her the pics and she wasn't surprised it sold out so quickly. But she thought the limitation numbers were the same as Folio LE's 750-1000, when I said 100 she laughed. This quality product, at this price point, will sell out every single time very quickly.
Increase limitation numbers - I think you could easily do this, make more money for yourself, but be careful not to over stretch yourself, and accept there will always be some disappointed people.
Increase price - for 100 leather bound you might have been able to charge £900/copy and still sell them quickly. However, that really narrows the demographic of buyers down and goes a little against the whole arts and craft movement and bringing fine products to the masses (well middle class in reality).
Keep it all the same - You may not have the free time to increase the number of volumes and maintaining other aspects of your life, and I would fully support this. Just accept there will always be people who miss out. I would do a first come first served, no pronouncement of the date, just some marketing on your blog that a new edition will be available in September. Those who check your site the most will notice when it's available and get first pick.
Apologies for the essay!
59LYRASBOOKS
Yes you're right that this is a side project. A bit of background - I work as a full-time bookbinder for a family run business here in the UK. Lyra's Books has been a side project for a couple of years. Mostly me doing rebinds of first editions. I won an international competition with a Gaiman book which put me in touch with the author. The rest happened from there.
As much as extra money is nice, I'm not looking to become a millionaire here so the added profit from extra limitations isn't a major consideration. I am sincerely doing this mostly because I just want to make nice books. The fact that Stardust is an absolute favourite of mine is the other reason I'm doing it. The main point is that myself, who will be doing the lions share of the work (and a small number of other binders here at the bindery to help with forwarding and box making) can only make so many books and boxes. Imagine, 100 leather bound books with boxes is considered a MAJOR job for us. Add another 500 cloth bound and 26 lettered and this is now the biggest thing we will have to do all year by a country mile. Adding 100 extra cloth bound is about the equivalent of 25 leather bound. So yes... Adding the to the limitation is not something that we will be doing I think. Although it may be something we can plan for if there's a next time.
The lottery thing seems to me like there's no foolproof way of doing it. I like the PayPal idea but then there are people who don't use it. I think that taking the remaining books to pre-order is now the only way.
Those points for the future are REALLY helpful thankyou! There's certainly lots to think about when this one is finished!
As much as extra money is nice, I'm not looking to become a millionaire here so the added profit from extra limitations isn't a major consideration. I am sincerely doing this mostly because I just want to make nice books. The fact that Stardust is an absolute favourite of mine is the other reason I'm doing it. The main point is that myself, who will be doing the lions share of the work (and a small number of other binders here at the bindery to help with forwarding and box making) can only make so many books and boxes. Imagine, 100 leather bound books with boxes is considered a MAJOR job for us. Add another 500 cloth bound and 26 lettered and this is now the biggest thing we will have to do all year by a country mile. Adding 100 extra cloth bound is about the equivalent of 25 leather bound. So yes... Adding the to the limitation is not something that we will be doing I think. Although it may be something we can plan for if there's a next time.
The lottery thing seems to me like there's no foolproof way of doing it. I like the PayPal idea but then there are people who don't use it. I think that taking the remaining books to pre-order is now the only way.
Those points for the future are REALLY helpful thankyou! There's certainly lots to think about when this one is finished!
60RRCBS
>59 LYRASBOOKS: I think you’ve done an amazing job trying to find a fair solution. I will definitely be preordering a cloth bound volume when the preorder becomes available!
61DMulvee
This would only work in the future, but I think that when you announce a new project you could invite interested people to enter their email address if they want to be kept informed on new development. Any time you have an update on that project you send an email to the mailing list that consists of interested people. Then when you are ready to accept pre-orders you send an email to the mailing list, that way everyone should (in theory) be notified at the same time.
An alternative is to do a Dutch auction for the special editions - but this definitely involves risk. In future you say there will be 26 Lettered Editions. The minimum price will be x. Interested parties have two weeks (say) to enter the amount they are happy to pay, at the end of the two weeks if you have 25 or less bids then you sell all 25 at the minimum price and have 1 or more left to sell at this price. If there are more than 26 people willing to pay the minimum price, you rank them from most expensive to least expensive and stop when you have 26 orders. All 26 pay the same price. So if the most expensive was £10k, and 26th is £1865, then you charge all 26 £1865.
An alternative is to do a Dutch auction for the special editions - but this definitely involves risk. In future you say there will be 26 Lettered Editions. The minimum price will be x. Interested parties have two weeks (say) to enter the amount they are happy to pay, at the end of the two weeks if you have 25 or less bids then you sell all 25 at the minimum price and have 1 or more left to sell at this price. If there are more than 26 people willing to pay the minimum price, you rank them from most expensive to least expensive and stop when you have 26 orders. All 26 pay the same price. So if the most expensive was £10k, and 26th is £1865, then you charge all 26 £1865.
62LYRASBOOKS
Yes the mailing list is something that I have just started to use. I would use a combination of the mailing list and social media to announce any new projects, pre-order dates etc.
I'm not sure I like the idea of the Dutch auction, although it's a very interesting concept! Obviously my minimum price would have to be what I would have sold them for anyway (otherwise it doesn't make good business sense). So trying to get anything over this would make me feel a bit greedy I think. Best to just set a price and stick with it.
My current prices work for me for this project. They don't need to be higher. Perhaps the limitation should have been higher but not the prices.
I'm not sure I like the idea of the Dutch auction, although it's a very interesting concept! Obviously my minimum price would have to be what I would have sold them for anyway (otherwise it doesn't make good business sense). So trying to get anything over this would make me feel a bit greedy I think. Best to just set a price and stick with it.
My current prices work for me for this project. They don't need to be higher. Perhaps the limitation should have been higher but not the prices.
63Levin40
Rich has posted a bunch of photos of the finalised leather version on his fb page (https://www.facebook.com/lyrasbooks/). It looks spectacular, to put it mildly. I think he made the correct decision to leave the boards plain, bar the gold dust, and move the 'cover' illustration to the slipcase (also on leather).
As stated, he'll be showcasing the other two versions over the next days and is hoping to open pre-orders on July 18th.
As stated, he'll be showcasing the other two versions over the next days and is hoping to open pre-orders on July 18th.
64U_238
Saw that too, thought it looked great, and I'm really looking forward to seeing the other two versions, much less actually getting it into my hands.
He really does know how to build anticipation - the sketch, final drawing, marbled paper, and now the first version.
He really does know how to build anticipation - the sketch, final drawing, marbled paper, and now the first version.
65DubiouslyDarling
I really would love to have a copy, I'm only worried I may miss it since I'm in America and might be asleep when it goes up. If I miss it I guess I could get a EP copy...
66U_238
He revealed the Lettered edition a short while ago on Facebook. It’s pretty spectacular.
Hopefully he’s got a good webmaster for his new site; it’s going to get pounded pretty hard on preorder day.
Hopefully he’s got a good webmaster for his new site; it’s going to get pounded pretty hard on preorder day.
67ubiquitousuk
The leather edition looks amazing, but I was a bit disappointed by the change in direction for the standard edition. No doubting the level of craftsmanship involved, but the prototype appealed much more to my aesthetic preferences. I guess there's no accounting for taste.
Edit: now that the blue version of the standard edition is revealed, I take it back. It looks amazing.
Edit: now that the blue version of the standard edition is revealed, I take it back. It looks amazing.
68U_238
I agree; not a great fan of the mustard-coloured quarter binding. I felt the calf leather across all three editions lent a level of cohesiveness to the set of books. Hopefully it does look better in person, as he said.
Also, do solander boxes usually have bands? It almost looks like a book itself. Would have liked to see the bands on the book, and more conventional box.
But still a great production.
Also, do solander boxes usually have bands? It almost looks like a book itself. Would have liked to see the bands on the book, and more conventional box.
But still a great production.
69Fierylunar
>68 U_238: A new blog post is now up: 250 will have a mustard-coloured spine, 250 a dark blue one. All editions will be printed letterpress by Hand and Eye Letterpress in London. Pre-order still expected for July 18th and an announcement a week beforehand, shipping will most likely start in October.
70kermaier
>68 U_238:
I actually like the mustard color for the spine -- blue over blue in blue slip-case looks a bit dull to my eyes.
I actually like the mustard color for the spine -- blue over blue in blue slip-case looks a bit dull to my eyes.
71DubiouslyDarling
>70 kermaier: I really like the mustard color as well for the spine. I feel like it really complements the gold on the slipcase and the yellow in the marble papers.
72wongie
>70 kermaier: I agree dark blue on blue doesn't provide much of an eye-catching contrast, but then again I don't think mustard yellow, of all colours, is all that great to my eyes either against the gold title stamp and I think it's just a downright weird colour combination. I would have gone for a more brighter blue or violet cloth. Since i'll likely toss the slipcase (not literally) anyway I'll probably be going for the blue providing it doesn't sell out before I try to nab one.
74wongie
>73 NLNils:
Pretty nice seems like an understatement. I seem to be developing a soft soft of three piece bradle bindings, alas not so soft as to be able to shell out £1550.
Pretty nice seems like an understatement. I seem to be developing a soft soft of three piece bradle bindings, alas not so soft as to be able to shell out £1550.
76Sorion
Pre-Order is today:
The pre-order for the Stardust limited edition opens today at 9pm UK time (BST)
This is just a reminder that the pre-order for our Stardust limited edition opens later today. Orders can be placed from 9pm sharp UK time (BST). A list of different time zones can be found at the bottom of this message.
You will be able to pay via PayPal or credit/debit card (Stripe). After you have proceeded to the checkout you will have to fill in your shipping details before making a payment. Orders will not be reserved until checkout is completed.
Almost all of the Standard edition are still available to buy (both colours) and a limited quantity of the other two editions. The pre-order will work on a first come first served basis and when they are sold out they are sold out!
When the countdown timer on the listings reaches zero, refresh the page and 'add to basket'!
Full pricing and shipping details can be found in the shop and on the listings pages now - www.lyrasbooks.com/shop
Time Zones -
UTC Time Zone Sat, 25 Jul at 20:00
London, UK Sat, 25 Jul at 21:00 BST
Paris, France Sat, 25 Jul at 22:00 CEST
Rome, Italy Sat, 25 Jul at 22:00 CEST
New York, USA Sat, 25 Jul at 16:00 EDT
San Francisco, USA Sat, 25 Jul at 13:00 PDT
Melbourne, Australia Sun, 26 Jul at 06:00 AEST
Auckland, New Zealand Sun, 26 Jul at 08:00 NZST
Check the countdown timers in the shop to be sure!
I expect production of the books to take about 3 months so delivery will be sometime in or around October 2020.
Thanks!
Rich @ Lyra's Books
The pre-order for the Stardust limited edition opens today at 9pm UK time (BST)
This is just a reminder that the pre-order for our Stardust limited edition opens later today. Orders can be placed from 9pm sharp UK time (BST). A list of different time zones can be found at the bottom of this message.
You will be able to pay via PayPal or credit/debit card (Stripe). After you have proceeded to the checkout you will have to fill in your shipping details before making a payment. Orders will not be reserved until checkout is completed.
Almost all of the Standard edition are still available to buy (both colours) and a limited quantity of the other two editions. The pre-order will work on a first come first served basis and when they are sold out they are sold out!
When the countdown timer on the listings reaches zero, refresh the page and 'add to basket'!
Full pricing and shipping details can be found in the shop and on the listings pages now - www.lyrasbooks.com/shop
Time Zones -
UTC Time Zone Sat, 25 Jul at 20:00
London, UK Sat, 25 Jul at 21:00 BST
Paris, France Sat, 25 Jul at 22:00 CEST
Rome, Italy Sat, 25 Jul at 22:00 CEST
New York, USA Sat, 25 Jul at 16:00 EDT
San Francisco, USA Sat, 25 Jul at 13:00 PDT
Melbourne, Australia Sun, 26 Jul at 06:00 AEST
Auckland, New Zealand Sun, 26 Jul at 08:00 NZST
Check the countdown timers in the shop to be sure!
I expect production of the books to take about 3 months so delivery will be sometime in or around October 2020.
Thanks!
Rich @ Lyra's Books
77wongie
Were I thinking rationally I should only jump in on one of the standard editions since I'm not a fantasy reader nor have I read, or have idea idea whether I'd like, Stardust but that full leather binding is so beautiful that I'm still dallying about, 124 days after the initial announcement, whether to buy that edition...
78Juniper_tree
I think these will have all gone by 21:05 BST!
79venkysuniverse
I could not even see a single leather copy at 9:00:01 sec :)
80SF-72
>79 venkysuniverse:
Well, that's not good. There were supposed to be some left.
Anyway, as beautiful as the leather edition is, fortunately for me I wanted and managed to buy the standard blue edition. I'm really looking forward to it.
Well, that's not good. There were supposed to be some left.
Anyway, as beautiful as the leather edition is, fortunately for me I wanted and managed to buy the standard blue edition. I'm really looking forward to it.
81c_schelle
>79 venkysuniverse: I had a leather copy in my basket, but I decided to go with the blue cloth version. I would have loved to get the leather version, but I can't afford it at the moment.
82wdripp
I was hoping to snag a standard copy, but I see no way to order on the page. I'm not sure if these are sold out already, or if I'm missing something...
83venkysuniverse
>80 SF-72: Even me. Thankfully had pre-ordered the standard edition.
84c_schelle
>82 wdripp: The yellow seems to be not available anymore, but the blue can still be added to the basket.
85venkysuniverse
>81 c_schelle: Oh ok. The database was down till exactly 9pm for me (I tried from 8:55pm) and then when I refreshed the page, all gone!
86venkysuniverse
>82 wdripp: The Standard Blue is still available and you should see it here:
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/stardust/standard-blue/
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/stardust/standard-blue/
87c_schelle
>85 venkysuniverse: I also got the error, but after refreshing at 9:00 I was able to add it.
88wdripp
>84 c_schelle: The yellow just came up (I could only see the blue initially) and I was able to order it.
I would have been satisfied with the blue but the yellow really called to me.
I would have been satisfied with the blue but the yellow really called to me.
89Juniper_tree
Still available in standard, the website glitched at the start so I reckon a lot of people logged out thinking they missed them. Worth trying again.
90Dr.Fiddy
>80 SF-72: "I wanted and managed to buy the standard blue edition. I'm really looking forward to it."
Me too 😊
Me too 😊
91folio_books
The glitch for me was PayPal. Wouldn't let me on to the site to pay for the book. Tried ringing them - they were extremely busy and technical support was closed. Fortunately Lyra's Books will also accept an old-fashioned credit card. I got what I wanted - a standard blue - but I noticed at 9.15 I was order number 438.
92wongie
>91 folio_books: That seems a little strange, my order number was 447 at 21:02
93stopsurfing
>85 venkysuniverse: Me too: refresh, nothing, refresh, nothing, refresh, nothing, refresh, Out of stock :(
The Standard Blue is much cheaper though and will be 90% of the Leather version, so I'll be more than happy with that one and won't have to treat it so much like a sacred object...
The Standard Blue is much cheaper though and will be 90% of the Leather version, so I'll be more than happy with that one and won't have to treat it so much like a sacred object...
95Jobasha
Dang. I really wanted the Standard edition! But with shipping at 60 pounds to Australia...
96agitationalporcelain
My order number was 866 at 21:20 (it wasn't until then that the order button appeared on the page for the mustard edition for me). Perhaps the numbers are randomly generated? I hope I'm not literally order #866 anyway given that that number far exceeds the number of books available!
Strangely, the order button appeared on the browser on my phone a couple of minutes before it appeared on my tablet's browser - I checked both when it didn't materialise on my tablet in case it was a caching issue from before the pre-orders went live. The order button for the blue appeared almost immediately on both devices but I decided to hold out for the mustard in the hope that it was just website gremlins. Glad I did!
Strangely, the order button appeared on the browser on my phone a couple of minutes before it appeared on my tablet's browser - I checked both when it didn't materialise on my tablet in case it was a caching issue from before the pre-orders went live. The order button for the blue appeared almost immediately on both devices but I decided to hold out for the mustard in the hope that it was just website gremlins. Glad I did!
97DubiouslyDarling
I got a Mustard Standard copy! I was on the fence initially, I've never read this book before, and it's pretty expensive for me, but I also couldn't find any other edition I liked (the "gift" edition is tiny, and EP edition costs more and doesn't have a slip case). In the end I couldn't resist!
Edit: Mine was order #986 placed around 15:46 American Central Time.
Edit: Mine was order #986 placed around 15:46 American Central Time.
98venkysuniverse
>87 c_schelle: That is good. Not too sad as the standard one looks good as well. More money to buy another LE :)
100GusLogan
>96 agitationalporcelain:
Same worry here with order no. 940+. But I was only just across the fence on this one, so it won’t be a tragedy for me if it falls through.
Same worry here with order no. 940+. But I was only just across the fence on this one, so it won’t be a tragedy for me if it falls through.
101SF-72
Oh dear about those website or computer glitches. I was lucky in that the edition I wanted anyway worked perfectly (the purchase button was active right when I refreshed the article page), as did Paypal. But to imagine that one may have wanted the leather and missed out on it because the button didn't go active properly...
102SF-72
I had order 387 confirmed one minute after 10 local time / after it became available, so I can't imagine that they started at zero. But numbers in the 800s and 900s do sound a bit worrying compared to the number of available books.
103c_schelle
Has anybody gotten an e-mail confirmation of their order? I got a confirmation in the browser, but I haven't gotten one by e-mail. Order number #488.
104folio_books
>103 c_schelle:
Yes, I got a receipt almost immediately and email confirmation this morning.
I also noticed that, while the leather and lettered editions had sold out, the standard editions were still in stock, so anyone worrying about a high order number can relax, I think.
Edited for afterthought.
Yes, I got a receipt almost immediately and email confirmation this morning.
I also noticed that, while the leather and lettered editions had sold out, the standard editions were still in stock, so anyone worrying about a high order number can relax, I think.
Edited for afterthought.
105c_schelle
>104 folio_books: Perhaps he is sending them out manually. As you only got your e-mail confirmation this morning I will wait for a few more hours as your order number is lower than mine.
As to the order numbers. It is possible that he just upgraded the previous website and the order number of oderers prior to Stardust are still in the system therefore starting with a higher order number.
As to the order numbers. It is possible that he just upgraded the previous website and the order number of oderers prior to Stardust are still in the system therefore starting with a higher order number.
106agitationalporcelain
>103 c_schelle:
No I haven't received email confirmation either, just the website confirmation page and my paypal receipt.
>100 GusLogan:
Same here, I'm not really too worried as the edition I ordered is still in stock on the website now, so I don't think it can have been oversold. But my reason for wanting the book was more because of the beautiful design/craftsmanship than wanting a copy of Stardust in particular, though I'll appreciate the opportunity to read it in such a nice edition. But if I miss out I'm sure there'll be a chance to buy other equally lovely books from LB in the future. Though the combination of the mustard and the colours in the marbling really calls out to me, there's something about it that just ticks all my aesthetic boxes, so OK, maybe I'd be a little bit disappointed to miss out ;)
No I haven't received email confirmation either, just the website confirmation page and my paypal receipt.
>100 GusLogan:
Same here, I'm not really too worried as the edition I ordered is still in stock on the website now, so I don't think it can have been oversold. But my reason for wanting the book was more because of the beautiful design/craftsmanship than wanting a copy of Stardust in particular, though I'll appreciate the opportunity to read it in such a nice edition. But if I miss out I'm sure there'll be a chance to buy other equally lovely books from LB in the future. Though the combination of the mustard and the colours in the marbling really calls out to me, there's something about it that just ticks all my aesthetic boxes, so OK, maybe I'd be a little bit disappointed to miss out ;)
107agitationalporcelain
Just received my email confirmation from LB.
108SF-72
>103 c_schelle:
Yes, I got it right away, with the note that it would only be valid once payment was received. Since I paid with Paypal during the order process I found that a bit strange, but it might be an issue with credit card payments.
Yes, I got it right away, with the note that it would only be valid once payment was received. Since I paid with Paypal during the order process I found that a bit strange, but it might be an issue with credit card payments.
109c_schelle
>108 SF-72: Rich just contacted me. I messed up my e-mail address and a letter was missing. He correctly identfied the error. If not I would have written him this evening.
110Sorion
From the sounds of things Rich has handled a pretty difficult situation quite well. It's not easy to publish your first book or to run your first internet pre-sale. He's done as good a job as can be expected all around. Can't wait to see what he has in mind after Stardust!
111SF-72
As it turned out, my order went through but Paypal put some payments on hold, including mine. Fortunately that can be corrected by cancelling the payment and then waiting for a new invoice. It looks like there are quite a few issues, which is little wonder with a new system and this kind of rush, but they're really nice about handling them.
112DubiouslyDarling
I just got an email saying I need to cancel my paypal payment because there are issues with it, and I'll be sent another invoice later. I'm wondering if Paypal is still being a pain about pre-orders, I know at some point if you couldn't fulfill a pre-order within 30 days of taking the money Paypal gets fussy and freezes funds and such, I'm not sure if they are still doing that.
113SF-72
>112 DubiouslyDarling:
Interesting theory. If that's it, other publishers have found a way around it, though. I've waited a lot longer than that for books from Subterranean Press or Suntup.
Interesting theory. If that's it, other publishers have found a way around it, though. I've waited a lot longer than that for books from Subterranean Press or Suntup.
114DubiouslyDarling
>113 SF-72: I've found that most of time when I'm doing a pre-order through paypal, I'm not being charged for it by the company until it has shipped. And I just know that this is an issue when buying fan-zines on the internet, this caused a huge issue a couple of years ago, and lots of fan publications had to figure out to get around the paypal issue because they couldn't use it for pre-orders anymore, with some circles having funds frozen before finding out about the rule change. It might be different for big businesses vs. indie shops and self-publishers. I just find it all very confusing.
115SF-72
>114 DubiouslyDarling:
I'm sure it is confusing and a big hassle. I can only say that for the publishers I mentioned as well as Bookdepository, there seems to be a way around it, but I don't know how. The problem might be that as a rule, Paypal limits its buyer protection to a limited time span after a purchase, so if the item in question isn't available yet shortly before that window closes that might be an issue.
I'm sure it is confusing and a big hassle. I can only say that for the publishers I mentioned as well as Bookdepository, there seems to be a way around it, but I don't know how. The problem might be that as a rule, Paypal limits its buyer protection to a limited time span after a purchase, so if the item in question isn't available yet shortly before that window closes that might be an issue.
116filox
>110 Sorion: I think Rich is handling this rather well, but I hope in the future he moves to a more automated process. For example, sending email confirmations by hand just doesn't scale. And it does seem like there's issues with payments as well as glitches in the website. Here's hoping that he gets someone to fix that side of things so it runs more smoothly next time and Rich can focus on what he does best -- the beautiful books we all enjoy.
117DubiouslyDarling
>99 Jobasha: I can't find it anywhere, but it appears to me that all the editions would be roughly the same size. There is a youtube video for the binding of the lettered edition that helps to give an idea on how big the book is.
118stopsurfing
And the standard blue is out of stock...
>99 Jobasha: I asked Rich the size question on Facebook a few weeks ago and he said the trimmed page size will be 245x175mm. I’m guessing he was talking about the standard version but I’m not sure, sorry. Hope it gives you an idea...
>99 Jobasha: I asked Rich the size question on Facebook a few weeks ago and he said the trimmed page size will be 245x175mm. I’m guessing he was talking about the standard version but I’m not sure, sorry. Hope it gives you an idea...
119SF-72
In hindsight I find all this interesting in that I took the lack of a purchase button to mean that the edition was already sold out. Instead it just wasn't shown. Am I glad I wasn't after the numbered leather edition, that would have been really frustrating.
>116 filox:
Yes, the website definitely needs fixing, as good as the personal service is.
>116 filox:
Yes, the website definitely needs fixing, as good as the personal service is.
120Jobasha
>117 DubiouslyDarling:
>118 stopsurfing:
Thank you both. I did end up buying the standard blue.
Judging from the trimmed paper size I think the book probably has the following dimensions (in slipcase):
25.4x18.0x4.8cm
Or approximately the size of the Holinshed Chronicles.
>118 stopsurfing:
Thank you both. I did end up buying the standard blue.
Judging from the trimmed paper size I think the book probably has the following dimensions (in slipcase):
25.4x18.0x4.8cm
Or approximately the size of the Holinshed Chronicles.
121Juniper_tree
Anyone still interested there is only 35 copies of the Mustard Standard edition left.
122elladan0891
>91 folio_books:
Glenn,
Looks like your account got hijacked - some bloke is posting under your username saying he bought a non-Folio!
Glenn,
Looks like your account got hijacked - some bloke is posting under your username saying he bought a non-Folio!
123folio_books
>122 elladan0891: some bloke is posting under your username saying he bought a non-Folio
Mea culpa. It will become, in fact, the second non-Folio in my collection, having bought the Good Omens LE last year. While it's not the perfect record I might perhaps have wished for, I think at least I got the balance right - 2 non-Folio, 1832 Folio.
Mea culpa. It will become, in fact, the second non-Folio in my collection, having bought the Good Omens LE last year. While it's not the perfect record I might perhaps have wished for, I think at least I got the balance right - 2 non-Folio, 1832 Folio.
124Juniper_tree
>123 folio_books: shows how special this edition is then to persuade you.....
125Hrodberht
>121 Juniper_tree: Anyone still interested there is only 35 copies of the Mustard Standard edition left.
Looks like the Mustard Standard edition has now sold out as well. I was another Standard Blue at 21:02.
Looks like the Mustard Standard edition has now sold out as well. I was another Standard Blue at 21:02.
126elladan0891
>123 folio_books:
I admit I was tempted. I have no issues buying non-Folios, but I'm not that big on fantasy - apart from reading fantasy I enjoyed in my teens for nostalgic purposes, I don't pick up new fantasy very often. And even then I was tempted. But after buying 13 sale and 2 full-price FS titles, The History of The Limited Editions Club, and Foolscap Press' Travels of Mandeville, my wallet gave me a very stern lecture and threatened to report me to my wife, so I gave it a pass.
I admit I was tempted. I have no issues buying non-Folios, but I'm not that big on fantasy - apart from reading fantasy I enjoyed in my teens for nostalgic purposes, I don't pick up new fantasy very often. And even then I was tempted. But after buying 13 sale and 2 full-price FS titles, The History of The Limited Editions Club, and Foolscap Press' Travels of Mandeville, my wallet gave me a very stern lecture and threatened to report me to my wife, so I gave it a pass.
127Redshirt
In case anyone is unaware, Richard Tong has posted a number of videos on the Lyra's Books Facebook site showing the various steps involved in the manufacture of the Stardust books. I suspect the videos would be of interest to many in this group.
128U_238
The videos are pretty mesmerizing. Someone suggested he stitch them all together when the production is complete, which I think is a good idea.
129const-char-star
For those that haven’t seen it, Richard Tong posted a longer video demonstrating his process for binding the Lettered Editions: https://youtu.be/ExJ2mwGTI0E
130astropi
>123 folio_books: hey, to each their own! but having a library consisting for all intensive purposes of one publisher is in my mind the same as eating the same meal all your life and thinking "I'm sure there's nothing more delicious or appetizing, even if I have never tried anything else". And don't get me wrong, some of my favorite publications are from the Folio Society, but wow, there's a whole wonderful world out there to ease the pains of those afflicted by bibliophilia. As for this particular edition, I think it will be a "classic" of publishing. I really do believe this edition will be considered one of the "greats" in the future, and while it won't start a revolution alike the Kelmscott Chaucer, it will be known in circles as a work of art and will be extremely desirable -- so congrats to all that ordered!
131Sorion
Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait!
132folio_books
>130 astropi:
I've been collecting them for close on 50 years. I simply couldn't afford to collect the offerings of other publishers on top of that, even if I wanted them. In terms of space, my library is spread over two houses as it is. As you can see, if I spot something really worth having, I go for it. No need for you to worry yourself over my literary diet.
I've been collecting them for close on 50 years. I simply couldn't afford to collect the offerings of other publishers on top of that, even if I wanted them. In terms of space, my library is spread over two houses as it is. As you can see, if I spot something really worth having, I go for it. No need for you to worry yourself over my literary diet.
133astropi
>132 folio_books: oh, definitely not worried :)
As I said, to each their own. I will add when I started my biblio journey, I was only collecting Easton Press, which at the time seemed to me to be the pinnacle of bookmaking. Ah, how young and naive I was! If I had only remained interested in Easton or Folio books, I would never have found other truly amazing works. My advice for the young bibliophile is to take risks, explore new horizons, partake of the different great publishers such as the Limited Editions Club, Allen Press, and others - many of which are astoundingly affordable (and certainly some will cost more than just a pretty penny)...
>131 Sorion: this has excited me more than any other forthcoming book in recent memory. I do hope and believe this might be one of those editions that really become iconic.
As I said, to each their own. I will add when I started my biblio journey, I was only collecting Easton Press, which at the time seemed to me to be the pinnacle of bookmaking. Ah, how young and naive I was! If I had only remained interested in Easton or Folio books, I would never have found other truly amazing works. My advice for the young bibliophile is to take risks, explore new horizons, partake of the different great publishers such as the Limited Editions Club, Allen Press, and others - many of which are astoundingly affordable (and certainly some will cost more than just a pretty penny)...
>131 Sorion: this has excited me more than any other forthcoming book in recent memory. I do hope and believe this might be one of those editions that really become iconic.
134Sorion
>133 astropi: I agree completely. What's more there is a chance that an exciting new publisher lays down a marker with this book for the entire industry to see. Lyra's books has a very bright future if this comes off how it was planned.
135astropi
>134 Sorion: I know what you mean, although he obviously works very slow and meticulously, so I imagine it's likely to be a book every few years... but hey, no problem with me :)
136hamletscamaro
For those liking something a bit different from another good binder, Beehive Books is producing a very different form of Dracula. They've opened it up for a second offering on Kickstarter.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/beehivebooks/dracula-the-evidence-hardcover...
I'm not at all associated with Beehive, and many of their offering don't interest me. This is a collection of ephemera and documents, so an entirely different way to experience Dracula. I did back the project.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/beehivebooks/dracula-the-evidence-hardcover...
I'm not at all associated with Beehive, and many of their offering don't interest me. This is a collection of ephemera and documents, so an entirely different way to experience Dracula. I did back the project.
137Raenas
>134 Sorion:
Books like these are not sustainable long term, or need a much higher price point. Suntup books are great for example, but none are as perfect as Misery, which was his first, and put heart and soul into it, and sold apparently at cost as well. He had to up the price point / decrease quality so that the press became sustainable.
Books like these are not sustainable long term, or need a much higher price point. Suntup books are great for example, but none are as perfect as Misery, which was his first, and put heart and soul into it, and sold apparently at cost as well. He had to up the price point / decrease quality so that the press became sustainable.
138astropi
>136 hamletscamaro: for me, I simply can't help feeling this is kitsch. I thought their original "Dracula the Evidence" was kitsch
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/beehivebooks/dracula-the-evidence
and now they have "Dracula the Evidence Hardcover Edition" which strikes me as kitsch and a money grab. Still, that's simply my opinion and considering how much the project has already received, there are many people interested in it. I rather think something like this might be good at getting young kids involved in reading. I know when I was in elementary school I would have thought this was really cool.
>137 Raenas: You might be right. I do hope he makes a tidy profit and is able to offer similar quality books in the future. Binding is of course a very expensive process, but that is one thing he is an expert in.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/beehivebooks/dracula-the-evidence
and now they have "Dracula the Evidence Hardcover Edition" which strikes me as kitsch and a money grab. Still, that's simply my opinion and considering how much the project has already received, there are many people interested in it. I rather think something like this might be good at getting young kids involved in reading. I know when I was in elementary school I would have thought this was really cool.
>137 Raenas: You might be right. I do hope he makes a tidy profit and is able to offer similar quality books in the future. Binding is of course a very expensive process, but that is one thing he is an expert in.
139Pellias
>122 elladan0891: Glenn,
Looks like your account got hijacked - some bloke is posting under your username saying he bought a non-Folio!
We got him ! Finally. That .. that .. snake !
Looks like your account got hijacked - some bloke is posting under your username saying he bought a non-Folio!
We got him ! Finally. That .. that .. snake !
140Levin40
>131 Sorion: Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait Can't Wait
You won't have to for much longer :). Rich just posted a FB update showing some impressive tipping-in, and noted that they're on the home straight and shipping is estimated to start mid-November. So it's only a small delay and I think extrememely impressive given the current global situation and that it's his first such project.
It really is astounding to see just how much time-consuming, manual effort has gone into these books. I'm going to appreciate the final product even more having seen these videos.
You won't have to for much longer :). Rich just posted a FB update showing some impressive tipping-in, and noted that they're on the home straight and shipping is estimated to start mid-November. So it's only a small delay and I think extrememely impressive given the current global situation and that it's his first such project.
It really is astounding to see just how much time-consuming, manual effort has gone into these books. I'm going to appreciate the final product even more having seen these videos.
141Sorion
>140 Levin40: Tee-Hee!
142folio_books
My copy arrived this morning (no 80, standard blue) and it is superb. Special mention for the slipcase, which is of outstanding quality. Now waiting for his next project. Well done, Rich!
143venkysuniverse
>142 folio_books: I received mine as well right now and I too agree that the book's production quality is excellent and the slipcase too!. I think Rich has taken extreme care in every aspect of the production and the letterpress printing is perfect (as usual as it was Phil Abel from Hand and Eye). Mine was the standard blue edition and now waiting eagerly for his next project.
144Juniper_tree
Mine turned up and the leather is just sumptuous, my most beautiful book to date. The standard mustard is also amazing and waiting to members with better cameras to take amazing pics.
It’s the little details that Rich excels at, even down to the same limitation number for both copies. Cheers that man.
It’s the little details that Rich excels at, even down to the same limitation number for both copies. Cheers that man.
145EdmundRodriguez
Also very happy with my standard blue edition. It exceeded my already high expectations.
146U_238
Quite a few photos have started to pop up on Facebook. When I get mine, I will post them here also. Quite excited, but may be a little longer as I'm in Canada. Hopefully there won't be a lot of duties/taxes.
147Raenas
Just got my Leather edition today. I am blown away to be honest. Had high expectations, but they have been greatly exceeded. No stone left unturned, love all the small details and everything screams utmost attention and quality. Truly fantastic. Congratulations Rich!
148wongie
>146 U_238: Sorry to beat you to the punch! Only for the standard edition though. Lucky owners of the leather edition can post additional photos.
Just my initial thought but there's another happy owner here. Also being an owner of the Liber Bestiariam I can say Ludlows along with Richard both certainly do know how to make exceptional bindings. Everything is crisp and solid. Externally the marbling by Freya Scott certainly grabs your attention, the metallic paint is just downright addicting to stare at. The top edge of the book with the flecked gold is just sublime.
Letterpress is crisp and on the kiss spectrum and very consistent throughout with virtually no bite on any pages from what I've flicked through. Near the bottom of the collection of photos I've taken a shot of an end-of-chapter page with a lot of empty space, perhaps a smidgen out of focus but with no bite to be seen. Paper in the standard edition is nice and thick with the leather edition featuring more thicker stock. The frontispiece is tipped in, glued on 3 edges making it less flimsy than the way Folio tip theirs in on one glued edge. It's protected by a piece of rice paper permanent bound into the signature.
For the standard edition, at 155gbp this is excellent value. Although Folio volumes are extremely refined and polished they lack a certain handmade charm that Stardust oozes. Although I probably won't be committing to Lyra if they're focusing on fantasy I am 110% looking forward to see what they put out in future. That said, given the amazing value I may end up buying whatever they publish next anyway.
Just my initial thought but there's another happy owner here. Also being an owner of the Liber Bestiariam I can say Ludlows along with Richard both certainly do know how to make exceptional bindings. Everything is crisp and solid. Externally the marbling by Freya Scott certainly grabs your attention, the metallic paint is just downright addicting to stare at. The top edge of the book with the flecked gold is just sublime.
Letterpress is crisp and on the kiss spectrum and very consistent throughout with virtually no bite on any pages from what I've flicked through. Near the bottom of the collection of photos I've taken a shot of an end-of-chapter page with a lot of empty space, perhaps a smidgen out of focus but with no bite to be seen. Paper in the standard edition is nice and thick with the leather edition featuring more thicker stock. The frontispiece is tipped in, glued on 3 edges making it less flimsy than the way Folio tip theirs in on one glued edge. It's protected by a piece of rice paper permanent bound into the signature.
For the standard edition, at 155gbp this is excellent value. Although Folio volumes are extremely refined and polished they lack a certain handmade charm that Stardust oozes. Although I probably won't be committing to Lyra if they're focusing on fantasy I am 110% looking forward to see what they put out in future. That said, given the amazing value I may end up buying whatever they publish next anyway.
149SF-72
I'm eagerly awaiting my copy in Germany after reading this, but I haven't received a shipping confirmation so far. Did you?
150wongie
>149 SF-72: Yes I received email confirmation along with tracking information for my order yesterday.
151folio_books
>150 wongie: I received email confirmation along with tracking information for my order yesterday.
Me too.
Me too.
153SF-72
Thank you, then I'm sure I ordered later than you and my copy will be shipped later on. As long as there's tracking, all's well.
154SolerSystem
>152 kdweber: I think Rich said he was waiting till after the holiday weekend to start shipping to the States.
155kdweber
>154 SolerSystem: Thanks, that makes sense.
158U_238
It's First and Fine, so their books are usually less expensive on their website, this case being no exception. At $1,800 on Abes, and $1,650 on their website, I'd say it's an okay price, as I know other copies have sold for $1,800.
There are only 100 copies out there anyway, which is a much smaller limitation than many other limited editions of other publishers.
There are only 100 copies out there anyway, which is a much smaller limitation than many other limited editions of other publishers.
159stopsurfing
And it’s gone
160Raenas
>159 stopsurfing:
Given the limitation and quality, I expect it to settle around $3-4000 in the mid term. Now some folks are flipping for a quick buck, but this supply will dry up shortly and lead to higher prices, as I expect most people clinging onto their copy (like me, so 99 to go...). Also when it gets more around the internet, Gaiman has lots of fans.
Given the limitation and quality, I expect it to settle around $3-4000 in the mid term. Now some folks are flipping for a quick buck, but this supply will dry up shortly and lead to higher prices, as I expect most people clinging onto their copy (like me, so 99 to go...). Also when it gets more around the internet, Gaiman has lots of fans.
161stopsurfing
>160 Raenas: and I’ve got a big sad face :’(
162U_238
>160 Raenas: That’s a lot more than I would have thought, but can imagine it.
163astropi
The book is a masterpiece! Received my copy here in the USA, it's amazing. I opted for the leather edition which is signed by Charles Vess and Neil Gaiman (I'm a sucker for author's signature :)
First, I've never seen a cover like this before. Most leather-bound books are a single color or have some stamping. The closest I've ever come to a cover like this is with the LEC Martian Chronicles which had some silver "stars" although that cover is in cloth. You have to be some amazingly talented artist to be able to produce such a striking and beautiful cover, and of course Rich Tong is such a person. Second thing, this book is THICK! A hair under 300 pages, but since the book is printed on hefty 148 gsm paper, it allows for beautiful letterpress. The margins are wide and font large as is often the case with luxurious editions. The illustrations are sublime, but we all knew that was going to be the case since this is Charles Vess after all! They are all hand-tipped and include tissue guards, just as was the case during the Golden Age of bookmaking! The hand-marbled endpapers are striking - a perfect fit to the magnificent cover.
Perfect? Just about... although if someone will allow me to be a bit critical, I will be truthful and say I think the slipcase could have been better. First, the color of the slipcase is purple. I realize purple is the color of royalty, but it feels out of place with the rest of the design and motif of the book. Secondly, the stamped leather label is not on the spine but on the top of the book. Still, when all is said and done this book is one of the most beautiful I have seen. I have no doubt it will go down as one of the most sought-after fine press books in recent history.
First, I've never seen a cover like this before. Most leather-bound books are a single color or have some stamping. The closest I've ever come to a cover like this is with the LEC Martian Chronicles which had some silver "stars" although that cover is in cloth. You have to be some amazingly talented artist to be able to produce such a striking and beautiful cover, and of course Rich Tong is such a person. Second thing, this book is THICK! A hair under 300 pages, but since the book is printed on hefty 148 gsm paper, it allows for beautiful letterpress. The margins are wide and font large as is often the case with luxurious editions. The illustrations are sublime, but we all knew that was going to be the case since this is Charles Vess after all! They are all hand-tipped and include tissue guards, just as was the case during the Golden Age of bookmaking! The hand-marbled endpapers are striking - a perfect fit to the magnificent cover.
Perfect? Just about... although if someone will allow me to be a bit critical, I will be truthful and say I think the slipcase could have been better. First, the color of the slipcase is purple. I realize purple is the color of royalty, but it feels out of place with the rest of the design and motif of the book. Secondly, the stamped leather label is not on the spine but on the top of the book. Still, when all is said and done this book is one of the most beautiful I have seen. I have no doubt it will go down as one of the most sought-after fine press books in recent history.
164U_238
>163 astropi: Did you see the video showing how they got the gold “dust” onto the leather? I don’t wish to spoil it, but Lyra’s Facebook page has a number of videos, perhaps ten or so, showing the various stages of production of the book, including this crucial stage.
The simplicity of it made me chuckle, as I’m sure we’ve all encountered the phenomenon, but never thought it could be used productively.
The simplicity of it made me chuckle, as I’m sure we’ve all encountered the phenomenon, but never thought it could be used productively.
165filox
Btw if anyone is interested in seeing some pics, I posted a few over in the fine press forum thread: https://www.librarything.com/topic/318025#7335211
166sekhmet0108
>164 U_238: It looks like a toothbrush was dipped in gold paint and it was sprayed on. :D
I don't have FB, but would like to know how they did that.
I don't have FB, but would like to know how they did that.
167astropi
>164 U_238: Thanks for the heads-up. I look forward to watching those videos :)
And it's such a joy to read this magnificent book... I actually read Stardust when it first came out back in 1998. To this day, it's still my favorite work of Neil Gaiman. Now, it's also one of the finest fine press books I have ever seen.
And it's such a joy to read this magnificent book... I actually read Stardust when it first came out back in 1998. To this day, it's still my favorite work of Neil Gaiman. Now, it's also one of the finest fine press books I have ever seen.
168booksforreading
>167 astropi:
Congratulations for getting the book and for having such a joyful experience! Thank you for sharing your thoughts! It will probably be a very desirable edition of Stardust - not because of the author's signature (he has signed so many books and other things that I think that these without his signature are going to be more rare and more valuable :), but because of the amazing work of the printer, illustrator, and designer/binder.
Congratulations for getting the book and for having such a joyful experience! Thank you for sharing your thoughts! It will probably be a very desirable edition of Stardust - not because of the author's signature (he has signed so many books and other things that I think that these without his signature are going to be more rare and more valuable :), but because of the amazing work of the printer, illustrator, and designer/binder.
169Chemren
For those fortunate to hold a subscription for Lyra’s books, the private offer for Coraline went out this morning. Please check your e-mail. You have until Friday to respond.
170woodstock8786
Today the lottery mail for the numbered and lettered editions went out.
If anyone would like to join the lottery, there are even two lettered editions up for grabs! I wish I had the money, they look so good.
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/coraline/coraline-lettered-edition/
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/coraline/coraline-numbered-edition/
Note that you can only enter yourself once per edition, one per household as it is stated.
Good luck 🤞
If anyone would like to join the lottery, there are even two lettered editions up for grabs! I wish I had the money, they look so good.
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/coraline/coraline-lettered-edition/
https://www.lyrasbooks.com/shop/coraline/coraline-numbered-edition/
Note that you can only enter yourself once per edition, one per household as it is stated.
Good luck 🤞